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Author Topic: Cliques and the spirit of Intensity  (Read 7822 times)

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Offline Pyraxis

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Cliques and the spirit of Intensity
« on: May 01, 2008, 10:14:26 PM »
Warning - political rant. Apologies for length.  :P



I guess it's no surprise that among the rejects of the rejects, one of the hottest issues has always been cliques.

This is one reason I think it's important to know and defend anyone the community decides they don't like. That's a principle Intensity was founded on - though WP moderators were the villains in question at the time. It's a losing battle because you can't please and accommodate everybody, of course. But I think it's important to catch the ones who can't find a place anywhere else.

At the time I was on WP, there was a kind of informal mentorship system going on. The less functional people would invariably run afoul of the law, and when they did, a person more skilled at communicating online would step up and advocate for them to the mods. These guys - for some reason it was predominantly guys - were coming online and like almost every one of us, finding kinship among other people on the spectrum for the first time in their lives. But then they were getting kicked out for being unable to follow social rules.

On an asperger's site, I thought there was something wrong with that.

Now I have no problem with drawing lines for narcissists. It's necessary, in a world where they'll rape you or worse if you don't. But almost invariably I saw that these so called flamers weren't malicious, just incompetent and struggling with as many issues as the next guy.

So when Neuroman and McJagger founded Intensity 1, I saw this need for a community that was free enough to handle offensiveness, awkwardness, and rebelliousness, but still a benevolent community. A place for the rejects of the spectrum world.

This is why I advocate for fighting and anger here, at the expense of those who dislike hostility and those who just want a casual place to hang out. There are many communities that accomodate peaceful companionship. There is only one where it's okay to tell the people in charge to stick it up their collective asses.

Only it's not, as Calandale so effectively demonstrated.

The whole time Intensity's been in place, ever since too many people told Neuroman where to stick it and he responded by shutting the first one down, I've been trying to figure out a workable system to make this kind of community possible. Actually since before that - my position at WP, for the short time it lasted, was to intercept the site political shit before it got to Alex, so people could be free to criticize him without provoking his narcissistic defenses and getting themselves banned.

My old theory was that the power on a forum had to be split between several people, so that there was always somebody to cover for anyone who was too sick of or vulnerable to any given drama. But that's not going to help the clique effect. Now I'm thinking that there should also be a more obvious divide between webmaster(s) and owner(s). Seems like a lot of what's gone wrong here is the web folks not wanting to have to deal with borderline drama, which makes sense in 20-20 hindsight. Should have been obvious to me that putting social pressure on code monkeys is not a way to get things done cleanly.

But the social pressure only happens because the code monkeys are seen as the ones with all the power. And there's a big difference between installing emoticons on a site, making backups, and all the day to day operation tasks that people like Renaeden are so good at - and making decisions about community policies, fielding bullshit and drama, and similar social tasks. They take two completely different skill sets.

So I wonder what would happen on a site where the one who paid for it was not the one who maintained the code.
You'll never self-actualize the subconscious canopy of stardust with that attitude.

Offline Tesla

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Re: Cliques and the spirit of Intensity
« Reply #1 on: May 01, 2008, 10:16:17 PM »
Summation for those of us who don't really give a toss?
I came to this world with nothing
and I leave with nothing but love,
everything else is just borrowed.

Fuck it, we'll do it live.

Offline Phlexor

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Re: Cliques and the spirit of Intensity
« Reply #2 on: May 01, 2008, 11:21:50 PM »
I really feel for you over the Calandale situation. But he knew what he was doing when he was getting under certain peoples skin when the site direction wasnt going the way he wanted it to.

Was his ideas unreasonalbe? Perhaps. Was there something broken with the way this place is run/operated? I doubt it.

To make a big deal over seemingly nothing was a waste of his time and tallents (obviously some of you are going to agrue about tallents). But I think this place lost Calandale a long time ago. The Calanadale that we had recently wasnt like the old him at all,

To me this place is about being told 'what for' straight up and in your face. He thought he was doing it to the status quo, and the status quo thought they were doing it to him. In the end, only one ideology could win and it was a matter of wait and see as to which way it was going to go.

Acusing everyone of sucking up to the powers that be wasnt the way to go to win the hearts of those who could maybe have backed him up or whatever (dunno where that thought was going).

I agree this place is good for the unwanted and the unmanageable. But they need to understand not everyone is going to agree with them and that to sulk off isnt good form. Obviously they have to do what they feel they need.

I dont mean to come off angry or anything, but like you, this situation has upset me as well, for the same reasons as well as the ones I stated above.

At least that was my reason for suggesting an ignore mod.

Offline Pyraxis

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Re: Cliques and the spirit of Intensity
« Reply #3 on: May 02, 2008, 07:30:36 AM »
Summation for those of us who don't really give a toss?

Don't read the damn thread.

Or read the last sentence.
You'll never self-actualize the subconscious canopy of stardust with that attitude.

Offline renaeden

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Re: Cliques and the spirit of Intensity
« Reply #4 on: May 02, 2008, 07:45:55 AM »
I guess drama that blows up fast and is over with quickly is more exciting. But with the recent politics/clique/roundabout/circular arguing, it just kept being the same thing going on and on for too long and people got tired of it and got pissed off. Variety is what people want, I think.
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Offline Alex179

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Re: Cliques and the spirit of Intensity
« Reply #5 on: May 03, 2008, 06:59:28 AM »
Drama can be hilarious at times, I agree.   Sometimes it is completely worthless.

I would say that cliques really are not a good thing as far as what I have read about the original intended spirit of this site.   I pretty much agree with your post.
:P   Internets are super serious.

Offline odeon

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Re: Cliques and the spirit of Intensity
« Reply #6 on: May 03, 2008, 12:48:55 PM »
I try to stay away from the day to day handling of this place, apart from the web monkey duties, plus the issues that concern site security. I think Callaway, Renaeden, and Parts all do a terrific job, far better than I would have, had I decided to mess with the pure admin stuff.

That said, I need to point out that I2 is a large site these days, far from the little community that McJ and neuroman came up with, and as such it takes a lot more to maintain. The backups are no longer as easy to do while the MySQL tables are easier to corrupt, with more serious consequences than before. This means that I have to say no to things--ideals are great but an irresponsible admin can bring the site down--and the direct democracy we had at one point is impractical at best and a nightmare to me at worst. Call me a bore but I don't particularly like spending night after night repairing tables or hunting down some weird performance issue just to keep I2 up.

Yes, I chose to do this, nobody forced me, but that doesn't mean that I want the shit to happen, or approve of actions that cause me more trouble and sleepless nights. I chose this because I like the board and want it to live on.

I don't see what difference it makes to have the owner(s) and the web monkey separated. Ideally both care enough about the place to not simply walk away if it crashes, shrugging while moving on to the next board somewhere.
"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."

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Offline vodz

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Re: Cliques and the spirit of Intensity
« Reply #7 on: May 04, 2008, 08:40:00 AM »
Page-after-page of Odeon & Lucifer exchanging one-liners is acceptable compared to Calandale's spam?

I really abhor that shit so have them both ignored. Seriously immature fucking cunts.

My point is, it seems that you can post whatever you want on this site, as long as it's what "they" want.
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Offline Parts

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Re: Cliques and the spirit of Intensity
« Reply #8 on: May 04, 2008, 10:07:48 AM »
Page-after-page of Odeon & Lucifer exchanging one-liners is acceptable compared to Calandale's spam?

I really abhor that shit so have them both ignored. Seriously immature fucking cunts.

My point is, it seems that you can post whatever you want on this site, as long as it's what "they" want.

I'm sure this is not what they want you to post yet you did anyway and it has not been removed or altered.  Calandale's spam was not the issue and was fine it was the endless nit picking arguments that was the issue.
"Eat it up.  Wear it out.  Make it do or do without." 

'People who say it cannot be done should not interrupt those who are doing it.'
George Bernard Shaw

Offline Lucifer

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Re: Cliques and the spirit of Intensity
« Reply #9 on: May 04, 2008, 10:49:35 AM »
Page-after-page of Odeon & Lucifer exchanging one-liners is acceptable compared to Calandale's spam?

I really abhor that shit so have them both ignored. Seriously immature fucking cunts.

My point is, it seems that you can post whatever you want on this site, as long as it's what "they" want.

too right.  :smarty:  see?

nurse, i think we're going to need a forceps delivery to get him out of his own arse.   :o
« Last Edit: May 04, 2008, 11:03:53 AM by Lucifer »

Offline Callaway

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Re: Cliques and the spirit of Intensity
« Reply #10 on: May 04, 2008, 11:00:45 AM »
Page-after-page of Odeon & Lucifer exchanging one-liners is acceptable compared to Calandale's spam?

I really abhor that shit so have them both ignored. Seriously immature fucking cunts.

My point is, it seems that you can post whatever you want on this site, as long as it's what "they" want.

That's the beauty of the ignore button, Vodzy.  If you don't want to read Lucifer's and Odeon's one-liners, you don't have to read them.

If I'm tired of reading Calandale spamming personal attacks against Dunc, Odeon and others all over the board and his posts which were weird repeated random quotes of other posts in the thread or another post by Callista, I don't have to read it.  If you enjoy reading it, then you are welcome to read it.

Here are a few examples of some of his posts that I prefer not to read, for your reading enjoyment since you do like them: 

http://www.intensitysquared.com/index.php/topic,8633.msg393309.html#msg393309

http://www.intensitysquared.com/index.php/topic,8612.msg393541.html#msg393541

http://www.intensitysquared.com/index.php/topic,8527.msg393302.html#msg393302

Offline odeon

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Re: Cliques and the spirit of Intensity
« Reply #11 on: May 04, 2008, 12:08:10 PM »
Page-after-page of Odeon & Lucifer exchanging one-liners is acceptable compared to Calandale's spam?

I really abhor that shit so have them both ignored. Seriously immature fucking cunts.

Calandale? That you?

Quote
My point is, it seems that you can post whatever you want on this site, as long as it's what "they" want.

You're allowed to continue, aren't you?
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Offline Alex179

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Re: Cliques and the spirit of Intensity
« Reply #12 on: May 04, 2008, 06:26:47 PM »
Page-after-page of Odeon & Lucifer exchanging one-liners is acceptable compared to Calandale's spam?

I really abhor that shit so have them both ignored. Seriously immature fucking cunts.

My point is, it seems that you can post whatever you want on this site, as long as it's what "they" want.
It was the redundancy of his messageboard politics criticism that got him blabberized.

I was given the link to this site by Calandale and I still think he is a good guy overall and find his posts interesting.  I just don't agree with the concern over internets politics.   RL politics are of importance and more worthy of discussion, serious or jokingly.
:P   Internets are super serious.

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Re: Cliques and the spirit of Intensity
« Reply #13 on: May 05, 2008, 06:58:19 AM »
Summation for those of us who don't really give a toss?

It's another of Pyraxis' boring essays where Intensity is going to hell for going against the spirit of the site, blah, blah.

She's been doing this for a year or so.

Offline Lucifer

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Re: Cliques and the spirit of Intensity
« Reply #14 on: May 05, 2008, 07:13:27 AM »
bitch.  :laugh: