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Author Topic: Should male cirumcision be outlawed?  (Read 2807 times)

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Offline Adam

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Should male cirumcision be outlawed?
« on: January 26, 2012, 05:18:08 PM »
except in cases where it's medically necessary, or a choice they make themselves when older?

Offline Callaway

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Re: Should male cirumcision be outlawed?
« Reply #1 on: January 26, 2012, 05:31:47 PM »
except in cases where it's medically necessary, or a choice they make themselves when older?

No, I don't believe that it should be outlawed.

Offline Adam

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Re: Should male cirumcision be outlawed?
« Reply #2 on: January 26, 2012, 05:34:23 PM »
Why not?

Offline Callaway

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Re: Should male cirumcision be outlawed?
« Reply #3 on: January 26, 2012, 05:38:26 PM »
For one thing, IMO, it's just another step on the way to becoming a nanny state where all decisions are made by the government for its citizens.  For another, male circumcision is a prominent part of at least two major religions and I think it would be wrong to stop them from following their religion by snipping off the foreskin of their male infants.

Offline Adam

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Re: Should male cirumcision be outlawed?
« Reply #4 on: January 26, 2012, 05:40:44 PM »
Wow. You think religious "rights" of parents to mutilate their children is more important than that child's right?

Whose penis is it

And I don't see how protecting children from being mutilated by adults with a mental illness (religion) is a "nanny state"

Sounds more like "sensible state" to me

Offline Queen Victoria

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Re: Should male cirumcision be outlawed?
« Reply #5 on: January 26, 2012, 05:48:28 PM »
Circumcision is more widespread and prevalent than I thought.  According to Wikepedia:

In some cultures, males must be circumcised shortly after birth, during childhood, or around puberty as part of a rite of passage. Circumcision is commonly practised in the Jewish and Islamic faiths.

Jewish law states that circumcision is a mitzva aseh ("positive commandment" to perform an act) and is obligatory for Jewish-born males and for non-circumcised Jewish male converts. It is only postponed or abrogated in the case of threat to the life or health of the child.[50] It is usually performed by a mohel on the eighth day after birth in a ceremony called a Brit milah (or Bris milah, colloquially simply bris), which means "Covenant of circumcision" in Hebrew. It is considered of such importance that in some Orthodox communities the body of an uncircumcised Jewish male will sometimes be circumcised before burial.[174] Although 19th centuryReform leaders described it as "barbaric", the practice of circumcision "remained a central rite"[175] and the Union for Reform Judaism has, since 1984, trained and certified over 300 practicing mohels under its "Berit Mila Program".[176]Humanistic Judaism argues that "circumcision is not required for Jewish identity."[177]

In Islam, circumcision is mentioned in some hadith (it is referred as Khitan), but not in the Qur'an. Some Fiqh scholars state that circumcision is recommended (Sunnah); others that it is obligatory.[178] Some have quoted the hadith to argue that the requirement of circumcision is based on the covenant withAbraham.[179] While endorsing circumcision for males, Islamic scholars note that it is not a requirement for converting to Islam.[180]

The Roman Catholic Church formally condemned the ritual observance of circumcision and ordered against its practice in the Ecumenical Council of Basel-Florence in 1442.[181] The Church presently maintains a neutral stance on circumcision as a medical practice.[182]

Circumcision is customary among the Coptic, Ethiopian, and Eritrean Orthodox Churches, and also some other African churches.[8] Some Christian churches in South Africa oppose circumcision, viewing it as a pagan ritual, while others, including the Nomiya church in Kenya,[8][183] require circumcision for membership. Some Christian churches celebrate theCircumcision of Christ.[184][185] The vast majority of Christians do not practise circumcision as a religious requirement.

Circumcision in South Korea is largely the result of American cultural and military influence following the Korean War. In West Africa infant circumcision may have had tribal significance as a rite of passage or otherwise in the past; today in some non-Muslim Nigerian societies it is medicalised and is simply a cultural norm.[186] Circumcision is part of initiation rites in some African, Pacific Islander, and Australian aboriginal traditions in areas such as Arnhem Land,[187] where the practice was introduced by Makassan traders from Sulawesi in the Indonesian Archipelago.[188] Circumcision ceremonies among certain Australian aboriginal societies are noted for their painful nature: subincision is practised amongst some aboriginal peoples in the Western Desert.[189]

In the Pacific, circumcision or superincision is nearly universal among the Melanesians of Fiji and Vanuatu,[190] while participation in the traditional land diving on Pentecost Island is reserved for those who have been circumcised.[191] Circumcision or superincision is also commonly practiced in the Polynesian islands of Samoa, Tonga, Niue, and Tikopia, where the custom is recorded as a pre-Christian/colonial practice. In Samoa it is accompanied by a celebration.

Among some West African groups, such as the Dogon and Dowayo, circumcision is taken to represent a removal of "feminine" aspects of the male, turning boys into fully masculine males.[192] Among the Urhobo of southern Nigeria it is symbolic of a boy entering into manhood. The ritual expression, Omo te Oshare ("the boy is now man"), constitutes a rite of passage from one age set to another.[193] For Nilotic peoples, such as the Kalenjin and Maasai, circumcision is a rite of passage observed collectively by a number of boys every few years, and boys circumcised at the same time are taken to be members of a single age set.[194]

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Offline Squidusa

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Re: Should male cirumcision be outlawed?
« Reply #6 on: January 26, 2012, 05:56:34 PM »
Well from a medical point of view.. it is hygenically better and apparently cuts down on the risk of causing infection?

So idk , if does do some good so I can appreciate it.

Plus , it saves aggro from religions , it doesn't harm anyone (and actually does some good) so why outlaw it?
I'll just diagnose myself as Goddess of the Universe and have done with it. Hell with autism!  :green: :zoinks:

nice is just something written on biscuits.  

Offline Adam

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Re: Should male cirumcision be outlawed?
« Reply #7 on: January 26, 2012, 06:00:04 PM »
We should never appease religions just to save aggro

Especially when it concerns inflicting that religious superstition onto children in a way they can never undo

And as long as someone washes themselves, hygeine shouldn't be a problem

Offline Calavera

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Re: Should male cirumcision be outlawed?
« Reply #8 on: January 27, 2012, 07:27:58 AM »
Gonna have to go with Adam on this one.

As for health benefits, I've yet to see a good case for circumcision.

Offline renaeden

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Re: Should male cirumcision be outlawed?
« Reply #9 on: January 27, 2012, 08:42:49 AM »
My little nephew (2½) had to have circumcision because his foreskin was too tight? Or something. It was rubbing on him anyway and my sister had a look and saw a large blood blister underneath it. So he had the procedure done. No problems since.
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Offline Calavera

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Re: Should male cirumcision be outlawed?
« Reply #10 on: January 27, 2012, 08:45:42 AM »
My little nephew (2½) had to have circumcision because his foreskin was too tight? Or something. It was rubbing on him anyway and my sister had a look and saw a large blood blister underneath it. So he had the procedure done. No problems since.

Fair enough, but that would just be an exceptional case for when the foreskin itself causes an exceptional problem for a specific individual. It's a special case that doesn't even apply to the majority of uncircumcised children/adults out there.


Offline Peter

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Re: Should male cirumcision be outlawed?
« Reply #11 on: January 27, 2012, 09:02:15 AM »
My little nephew (2½) had to have circumcision because his foreskin was too tight? Or something. It was rubbing on him anyway and my sister had a look and saw a large blood blister underneath it. So he had the procedure done. No problems since.

He had a blister underneath his foreskin at 2½?  His foreskin should have been firmly attached to his glans at that age, like a fingernail is attached to the nail bed, unless someone had forcefully retracted it (which often happens when people have culturally induced foreskin-anxiety and don't realise that it should be left alone).

I suspect that the apparent epidemic of foreskin problems that afflicts certain regions is more cultural than medical:

http://www.drmomma.org/2010/01/phony-phimosis-diagnosis.html
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14:10 - Moarskrillex42: She said something about knowing why I wanted to move to Glasgow when she came in. She plopped down on my bed and told me to go ahead and open it for her.

14:11 - Peter5930: So, she thought I was your lover and that I was sending you a box full of sex toys, and that you wanted to move to Glasgow to be with me?

Offline renaeden

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Re: Should male cirumcision be outlawed?
« Reply #12 on: January 27, 2012, 09:13:27 AM »
Not sure, Peter, maybe he fiddled with it himself? But yes, my sister could see there was blood underneath - she couldn't pull it back of course but she could see it looked like there was a red bruise, meaning blood there.
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Offline lutra

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Re: Should male cirumcision be outlawed?
« Reply #13 on: January 27, 2012, 09:47:36 AM »
Totally not relevant.. but did youz know that baby boys (<1 y/o) can/do get hard-ons?

Well, I didn't but an ex had a kiddo and she told me he had them when she cleaned the little fella. Was news for me. Thought it took some years to get it properly working there. Yes yes, I'm soo up to date/of this world. :zoinks:



Oh.. my stance concerning foreplay? :LOL: I mean foreskin and if circumcision should be outlawed?

Well, tough one.. Think I lean towards Adam's opinion here. It's not (prolly never) the will or wish of the kiddo to have it done. It's kinda a violation of someone's bodily integrity when it's done without that person's consent.
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Offline Peter

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Re: Should male cirumcision be outlawed?
« Reply #14 on: January 27, 2012, 09:55:18 AM »
Totally not relevant.. but did youz know that baby boys (<1 y/o) can/do get hard-ons?

Well, I didn't but an ex had a kiddo and she told me he had them when she cleaned the little fella. Was news for me. Thought it took some years to get it properly working there. Yes yes, I'm soo up to date/of this world. :zoinks:

I think it varies.  I don't remember getting erections until I was 11/12, and I remember quite a lot from my childhood.
Quote
14:10 - Moarskrillex42: She said something about knowing why I wanted to move to Glasgow when she came in. She plopped down on my bed and told me to go ahead and open it for her.

14:11 - Peter5930: So, she thought I was your lover and that I was sending you a box full of sex toys, and that you wanted to move to Glasgow to be with me?