Vivi's back!

[Callaway]

"Equine Psychology" could be extremely useful for a person who plans a career working with horses, though.

"Outdoor Adventure with Philosophy" could be valuable for people who head outdoor expeditions.

"Fashion Buying" could be useful training for the buyers who buy clothing fashions for stores.

"Golf Management" could be a good thing to know if it is your ambition to manage a golf course.

I'm not sure what a person who studies "Science:  Fiction and Culture" could do with the degree, but I'm certain there must be something.


And what exactly is wrong with the classics, anyway?


What is wrong with wanting an education just for the sake of being an educated person, even if all the person does with their education is stay home and raise children?

Sorry, this is an old discussion I had with my younger brother.  He said I was wasting my education if I stayed home and raised my daughter.

[Lucifer]

typical.  again, i come back to the point of trained minds, and the joy of education for its own sake.  good for you, callaway.  that sort of suggestion comes dangerously near to the old "women don't need to be educated" idea.  how mediaeval. 

[Christopher McCandless]

"Equine Psychology" could be extremely useful for a person who plans a career working with horses, though.

"Outdoor Adventure with Philosophy" could be valuable for people who head outdoor expeditions.

"Fashion Buying" could be useful training for the buyers who buy clothing fashions for stores.

"Golf Management" could be a good thing to know if it is your ambition to manage a golf course.

I'm not sure what a person who studies "Science:  Fiction and Culture" could do with the degree, but I'm certain there must be something.


And what exactly is wrong with the classics, anyway?


What is wrong with wanting an education just for the sake of being an educated person, even if all the person does with their education is stay home and raise children?

Sorry, this is an old discussion I had with my younger brother.  He said I was wasting my education if I stayed home and raised my daughter.

Nothing at all, asides the state is sponsoring you to do it (in the UK), so really the state should get something back out of it. Bear in mind these courses definately do not educate to degree level standard, and certainly will not provide job oppotunities at the level a degree should. If these people were actually getting a meaningful education i would object a lot less.

[Lucifer]

the state IS getting something out of it - someone bringing up their kid.

i see, as usual, that being a mother is relegated to "useless".  i sometimes wonder how far we've really come in the fight for equal opportuinites. 

[Tesla]

"Equine Psychology" could be extremely useful for a person who plans a career working with horses, though.

"Outdoor Adventure with Philosophy" could be valuable for people who head outdoor expeditions.

"Fashion Buying" could be useful training for the buyers who buy clothing fashions for stores.

"Golf Management" could be a good thing to know if it is your ambition to manage a golf course.

I'm not sure what a person who studies "Science:  Fiction and Culture" could do with the degree, but I'm certain there must be something.


And what exactly is wrong with the classics, anyway?


What is wrong with wanting an education just for the sake of being an educated person, even if all the person does with their education is stay home and raise children?

Sorry, this is an old discussion I had with my younger brother.  He said I was wasting my education if I stayed home and raised my daughter.

I think an educated mother would be able to raise a well informed, educated person.  Someone who is more aware of the world at large.

I'm constantly learning crap that has no bearing on my career, and things some would consider useless, but I love learning, simple as that.

[Lucifer]

excellent point, tesla.   

and i love learning just for the sake of it, too.  i want to be a walking encyclopaedia. 

[Christopher McCandless]

the state IS getting something out of it - someone bringing up their kid.

i see, as usual, that being a mother is relegated to "useless".  i sometimes wonder how far we've really come in the fight for equal opportuinites. 

Someone doing one of those courses has got almost nothing out of it, thats the whole point. They cant even pass on their knowledge to their children, becuase they gained none from that course. In Callaways case, I would agree with you because she took an academically rigourous course, and learned stuff.

[Tesla]

the state IS getting something out of it - someone bringing up their kid.

i see, as usual, that being a mother is relegated to "useless".  i sometimes wonder how far we've really come in the fight for equal opportuinites. 

Someone doing one of those courses has got almost nothing out of it, thats the whole point. They cant even pass on their knowledge to their children, becuase they gained none from that course. In Callaways case, I would agree with you because she took an academically rigourous course, and learned stuff.

Oh...  balls.  How do you know what people have gotten out of those courses?  Hadron, you make my ass twitch.

[Christopher McCandless]

the state IS getting something out of it - someone bringing up their kid.

i see, as usual, that being a mother is relegated to "useless".  i sometimes wonder how far we've really come in the fight for equal opportuinites. 

Someone doing one of those courses has got almost nothing out of it, thats the whole point. They cant even pass on their knowledge to their children, becuase they gained none from that course. In Callaways case, I would agree with you because she took an academically rigourous course, and learned stuff.

Oh...  balls.  How do you know what people have gotten out of those courses?  Hadron, you make my ass twitch.

The 25% or above drop out rates for a start. And the earlier report by the taxpayers allience, which I began with. Another thing that stands out is the laughable entry requirements, have you heard of the acronym GIGO before?

[mordok]

the state IS getting something out of it - someone bringing up their kid.

i see, as usual, that being a mother is relegated to "useless".  i sometimes wonder how far we've really come in the fight for equal opportuinites. 

Someone doing one of those courses has got almost nothing out of it, thats the whole point. They cant even pass on their knowledge to their children, becuase they gained none from that course. In Callaways case, I would agree with you because she took an academically rigourous course, and learned stuff.

Oh...  balls.  How do you know what people have gotten out of those courses?  Hadron, you make my ass twitch.

The 25% or above drop out rates for a start. And the earlier report by the taxpayers allience, which I began with. Another thing that stands out is the laughable entry requirements, have you heard of the acronym GIGO before?

Might it be possible that the high drop rate is due to people entering the class thinking the same as you and find out *gasp!* that they'll actually have to work?

[Christopher McCandless]

the state IS getting something out of it - someone bringing up their kid.

i see, as usual, that being a mother is relegated to "useless".  i sometimes wonder how far we've really come in the fight for equal opportuinites. 

Someone doing one of those courses has got almost nothing out of it, thats the whole point. They cant even pass on their knowledge to their children, becuase they gained none from that course. In Callaways case, I would agree with you because she took an academically rigourous course, and learned stuff.

Oh...  balls.  How do you know what people have gotten out of those courses?  Hadron, you make my ass twitch.

The 25% or above drop out rates for a start. And the earlier report by the taxpayers allience, which I began with. Another thing that stands out is the laughable entry requirements, have you heard of the acronym GIGO before?

Might it be possible that the high drop rate is due to people entering the class thinking the same as you and find out *gasp!* that they'll actually have to work?

I have no idea, you would have to ask them. It could also be the courses are total shit as well.

[mordok]

the state IS getting something out of it - someone bringing up their kid.

i see, as usual, that being a mother is relegated to "useless".  i sometimes wonder how far we've really come in the fight for equal opportuinites. 

Someone doing one of those courses has got almost nothing out of it, thats the whole point. They cant even pass on their knowledge to their children, becuase they gained none from that course. In Callaways case, I would agree with you because she took an academically rigourous course, and learned stuff.

Oh...  balls.  How do you know what people have gotten out of those courses?  Hadron, you make my ass twitch.

The 25% or above drop out rates for a start. And the earlier report by the taxpayers allience, which I began with. Another thing that stands out is the laughable entry requirements, have you heard of the acronym GIGO before?

Might it be possible that the high drop rate is due to people entering the class thinking the same as you and find out *gasp!* that they'll actually have to work?

I have no idea, you would have to ask them. It could also be the courses are total shit as well.

True enough.  My point, that you've just validated, is that you don't know either way.  You're talking out of your ass.  You've reached a conclusion and now any and all facts support that conclusion in your mind.

When the only tool you have is a hammer.....

[Christopher McCandless]

the state IS getting something out of it - someone bringing up their kid.

i see, as usual, that being a mother is relegated to "useless".  i sometimes wonder how far we've really come in the fight for equal opportuinites. 

Someone doing one of those courses has got almost nothing out of it, thats the whole point. They cant even pass on their knowledge to their children, becuase they gained none from that course. In Callaways case, I would agree with you because she took an academically rigourous course, and learned stuff.

Oh...  balls.  How do you know what people have gotten out of those courses?  Hadron, you make my ass twitch.

The 25% or above drop out rates for a start. And the earlier report by the taxpayers allience, which I began with. Another thing that stands out is the laughable entry requirements, have you heard of the acronym GIGO before?

Might it be possible that the high drop rate is due to people entering the class thinking the same as you and find out *gasp!* that they'll actually have to work?

I have no idea, you would have to ask them. It could also be the courses are total shit as well.

True enough.  My point, that you've just validated, is that you don't know either way.  You're talking out of your ass.  You've reached a conclusion and now any and all facts support that conclusion in your mind.

When the only tool you have is a hammer.....

Either way the course shouldnt be there. I would love to see an explaination for the high drop out rate that doesnt make the course look bad. I went to an HE fair about 18 months ago now, and at the fair there was a place called "Writtle College", who was selling some of these courses. They tried to sell them to me and my friend basically as a fun doss. They even gave us nice lollypops.

[mordok]

the state IS getting something out of it - someone bringing up their kid.

i see, as usual, that being a mother is relegated to "useless".  i sometimes wonder how far we've really come in the fight for equal opportuinites. 

Someone doing one of those courses has got almost nothing out of it, thats the whole point. They cant even pass on their knowledge to their children, becuase they gained none from that course. In Callaways case, I would agree with you because she took an academically rigourous course, and learned stuff.

Oh...  balls.  How do you know what people have gotten out of those courses?  Hadron, you make my ass twitch.

The 25% or above drop out rates for a start. And the earlier report by the taxpayers allience, which I began with. Another thing that stands out is the laughable entry requirements, have you heard of the acronym GIGO before?

Might it be possible that the high drop rate is due to people entering the class thinking the same as you and find out *gasp!* that they'll actually have to work?

I have no idea, you would have to ask them. It could also be the courses are total shit as well.

True enough.  My point, that you've just validated, is that you don't know either way.  You're talking out of your ass.  You've reached a conclusion and now any and all facts support that conclusion in your mind.

When the only tool you have is a hammer.....

Either way the course shouldnt be there. I would love to see an explaination for the high drop out rate that doesnt make the course look bad. I went to an HE fair about 18 months ago now, and at the fair there was a place called "Writtle College", who was selling some of these courses. They tried to sell them to me and my friend basically as a fun doss. They even gave us nice lollypops.

You've never taken one or any other college level course yet you say they shouldn't be there.  When asked for proof, you offer up supposition.  When called on that, you offer up an anecdote (i.e. one instance).  Here's a lesson I learned in college, anecdote <> data.

And regarding that anecdote itself, at that school it may have been a blowoff course.  Does that guarantee that similarly named courses in respectable and known places of education would also have no merit?

[Christopher McCandless]

the state IS getting something out of it - someone bringing up their kid.

i see, as usual, that being a mother is relegated to "useless".  i sometimes wonder how far we've really come in the fight for equal opportuinites. 

Someone doing one of those courses has got almost nothing out of it, thats the whole point. They cant even pass on their knowledge to their children, becuase they gained none from that course. In Callaways case, I would agree with you because she took an academically rigourous course, and learned stuff.

Oh...  balls.  How do you know what people have gotten out of those courses?  Hadron, you make my ass twitch.

The 25% or above drop out rates for a start. And the earlier report by the taxpayers allience, which I began with. Another thing that stands out is the laughable entry requirements, have you heard of the acronym GIGO before?

Might it be possible that the high drop rate is due to people entering the class thinking the same as you and find out *gasp!* that they'll actually have to work?

I have no idea, you would have to ask them. It could also be the courses are total shit as well.

True enough.  My point, that you've just validated, is that you don't know either way.  You're talking out of your ass.  You've reached a conclusion and now any and all facts support that conclusion in your mind.

When the only tool you have is a hammer.....

Either way the course shouldnt be there. I would love to see an explaination for the high drop out rate that doesnt make the course look bad. I went to an HE fair about 18 months ago now, and at the fair there was a place called "Writtle College", who was selling some of these courses. They tried to sell them to me and my friend basically as a fun doss. They even gave us nice lollypops.

You've never taken one or any other college level course yet you say they shouldn't be there.  When asked for proof, you offer up supposition.  When called on that, you offer up an anecdote (i.e. one instance).  Here's a lesson I learned in college, anecdote <> data.

And regarding that anecdote itself, at that school it may have been a blowoff course.  Does that guarantee that similarly named courses in respectable and known places of education would also have no merit?

No, they tried to sell me several courses (we let them because we liked the lollypops). If you want a more scientific arguement, you can compare the entry requirements of these courses with a meaningful course and see if it helps you make up your mind. Remember GIGO