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Offline RageBeoulve

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Agenda 21
« on: July 12, 2013, 06:41:07 PM »
The conservation plan for the brave society of the 21st century. A perfect society. Yeah... how many of you have read this document? Please discuss.
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Offline Kapkao

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Re: Agenda 21
« Reply #1 on: July 12, 2013, 06:45:23 PM »
needs moar links plzkthx  :yarly:
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Offline RageBeoulve

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Re: Agenda 21
« Reply #2 on: July 12, 2013, 06:52:59 PM »
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"I’m fearless in my heart.
They will always see that in my eyes.
I am the passion; I am the warfare.
I will never stop...
always constant, accurate, and intense."

  - Steve Vai, "The Audience is Listening"

Offline RageBeoulve

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Re: Agenda 21
« Reply #3 on: July 12, 2013, 07:02:03 PM »
In advance, i'll ask if you're shocked yet. I sure the fuck was. Hitler's third reich was a second rate child's birthday party compared to the stuff in there. I couldn't believe it.
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"I’m fearless in my heart.
They will always see that in my eyes.
I am the passion; I am the warfare.
I will never stop...
always constant, accurate, and intense."

  - Steve Vai, "The Audience is Listening"

Offline RageBeoulve

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Re: Agenda 21
« Reply #4 on: July 12, 2013, 07:17:52 PM »
Here, this lady explains part of why agenda 21 is so horrifying.

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"I’m fearless in my heart.
They will always see that in my eyes.
I am the passion; I am the warfare.
I will never stop...
always constant, accurate, and intense."

  - Steve Vai, "The Audience is Listening"

Offline sg1008

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Re: Agenda 21
« Reply #5 on: July 12, 2013, 07:19:57 PM »
I am going to post my assumptions about this based on what I heard discussed in the UN forum on Indigenous issues this past spring.

My assumption (without reading it) is that they are referring to sustainable development as basicially...instead of focusing on economic development as the sole end all be all, they are calling for more strategic planning and coordination so that further development will take into consideration: minority rights (particularily indigenous rights), climate change (and how to slow/reverse the impact), etc.

This would mean, planning which involved consideration for endangered species, warming oceans, Co2 emissions, etc. it is a coordinated effort which is what we fricking need right now if we don't want to lose the planet.

I've seen some good stuff come out of it- including talks on biodiversity, and greater protections for waterways in order to avoid a crisis-level fresh water shortage.

I dunno how much the UN can deliver in terms of indigenous rights because as a rule of thumb, the UN tends to regard indigenous people as wards, even though they have certain rights they cannot represent themselves as independent nations in the UN...

Anyways, that is what I understand of it. Doesn't scare me, in fact gives me a little hope. I am not sure 50% of the ppl who attend the conferences are serious, or on board, but at least shit is being said that needs to be said...

Anyways, I will read it more in depth and come back with another comment later.
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Quote from: hykeaswell on December 08, 2014, 04:14:58 AM
Quote from: sg1008 on December 08, 2014, 12:31:27 AM
Can't you guys even just imagine it?

Forget practicality, or your experience....can you just....imagine?

It's there. It always was.

Offline RageBeoulve

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Re: Agenda 21
« Reply #6 on: July 12, 2013, 07:20:41 PM »
This covers even more of the highlights, its in kind of a memeish form, and is shorter. Some may like this better.

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"I’m fearless in my heart.
They will always see that in my eyes.
I am the passion; I am the warfare.
I will never stop...
always constant, accurate, and intense."

  - Steve Vai, "The Audience is Listening"

Offline RageBeoulve

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Re: Agenda 21
« Reply #7 on: July 12, 2013, 07:25:25 PM »
Quote from: sg1008 on July 12, 2013, 07:19:57 PM
I am going to post my assumptions about this based on what I heard discussed in the UN forum on Indigenous issues this past spring.

My assumption (without reading it) is that they are referring to sustainable development as basicially...instead of focusing on economic development as the sole end all be all, they are calling for more strategic planning and coordination so that further development will take into consideration: minority rights (particularily indigenous rights), climate change (and how to slow/reverse the impact), etc.

This would mean, planning which involved consideration for endangered species, warming oceans, Co2 emissions, etc. it is a coordinated effort which is what we fricking need right now if we don't want to lose the planet.

I've seen some good stuff come out of it- including talks on biodiversity, and greater protections for waterways in order to avoid a crisis-level fresh water shortage.

I dunno how much the UN can deliver in terms of indigenous rights because as a rule of thumb, the UN tends to regard indigenous people as wards, even though they have certain rights they cannot represent themselves as independent nations in the UN...

Anyways, that is what I understand of it. Doesn't scare me, in fact gives me a little hope. I am not sure 50% of the ppl who attend the conferences are serious, or on board, but at least shit is being said that needs to be said...

Anyways, I will read it more in depth and come back with another comment later.

YEs those are all in there. Also included are plans to decrease the education of the common working child (yeah no kidding. The only education they will receive is what they will need for "work"), complete banning of the ownership of any property, destruction of the family(all children are to be wards of the state. All citizens are to relocate to designated areas, and live in efficient quarters, provided by the state. Constant surveillance and control will be the standard. Basically labor camps. Kind of like being in prison. Forever. I'm not kidding. Its all in there, dude.

Read it and you'll see, this is the REAL DEAL folks.
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"I’m fearless in my heart.
They will always see that in my eyes.
I am the passion; I am the warfare.
I will never stop...
always constant, accurate, and intense."

  - Steve Vai, "The Audience is Listening"

Offline Lestat

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Re: Agenda 21
« Reply #8 on: July 12, 2013, 09:34:29 PM »
I call bollocks on this.


I just read that lot. Yes, the entire fucking tedious great long drawn out thing, from one end to the other and I could find nothing of the sort.

As for education, all I could find were plans to increase access.
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Offline Parts

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Re: Agenda 21
« Reply #9 on: July 12, 2013, 09:47:10 PM »
I really don't think it will happen just too many problems and too much money at stake.
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Offline odeon

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Re: Agenda 21
« Reply #10 on: July 13, 2013, 02:25:08 AM »
http://www.icleiusa.org/about-iclei/faqs/faq-iclei-the-united-nations-and-agenda-21#what-is-agenda-21

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Agenda 21 is not a treaty or legally binding document and does not infringe upon the sovereignty of any nation, state, or local government. Agenda 21 does not advocate for abolishing private property or have any bearing on U.S. local and state land-use decisions. In other words, it isn’t being forced on anybody, anywhere, by any organization.
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Offline Lestat

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Re: Agenda 21
« Reply #11 on: July 13, 2013, 09:04:34 AM »
It did unnerve me to see them talking more hot air about regulating hazardous material shipping.

Wouldn't bloody believe the hazmat fees on some things already. Granted there are things that just should not be used anymore where alternatives are at all possible (dimethylmercury for instance, although it was once used for certain spectroscopy purposes, iirc for calibrating NMR machines used for assaying mercury or something, but its just too fucking insidiously toxic, any commercial shipping would just be too dangerous, as there is little that can be done for poisoning cases.)


But bans on CFS, etc. ...sure, we don't want them depleting the ozone layer, but on occasion, they DO make for very useful solvents, being highly inert for the most part. And another bitch of that nature. Carbon tet...sure, its toxic, its environmentally about as friendly as an arsehole full of rottweilers, but again, it is just about the most inert solvent going, but its so hard to find now, for environmental reasons, as well as toxicity, its not just hard to get, and expensive, but plenty of places just don't want anything to do with it now.
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Offline Parts

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Re: Agenda 21
« Reply #12 on: July 13, 2013, 09:50:38 AM »
Quote from: Lestat on July 13, 2013, 09:04:34 AM
It did unnerve me to see them talking more hot air about regulating hazardous material shipping.

Wouldn't bloody believe the hazmat fees on some things already. Granted there are things that just should not be used anymore where alternatives are at all possible (dimethylmercury for instance, although it was once used for certain spectroscopy purposes, iirc for calibrating NMR machines used for assaying mercury or something, but its just too fucking insidiously toxic, any commercial shipping would just be too dangerous, as there is little that can be done for poisoning cases.)


But bans on CFS, etc. ...sure, we don't want them depleting the ozone layer, but on occasion, they DO make for very useful solvents, being highly inert for the most part. And another bitch of that nature. Carbon tet...sure, its toxic, its environmentally about as friendly as an arsehole full of rottweilers, but again, it is just about the most inert solvent going, but its so hard to find now, for environmental reasons, as well as toxicity, its not just hard to get, and expensive, but plenty of places just don't want anything to do with it now.

They banned it's use in asthma inhalers like that was going to deplete all the ozone ::)
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Offline Kapkao

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Re: Agenda 21
« Reply #13 on: July 13, 2013, 11:46:33 AM »
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Offline Lestat

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Re: Agenda 21
« Reply #14 on: July 13, 2013, 11:59:47 AM »
And they still use fluorinated solvents....much good THAT did. I have a few inhalers hanging around, I'm not asthmatic, I don't need them, but I keep them for when I'm doing microbiology work that involves using penicillins as part of culture selection media, as I'm badly allergic to beta-lactam antibiotics (and to a lesser degree, to tetracycline).

The propellant is still a polyhalogenated fluorinated something or other, I forget which now, but once broken up in the atmosphere to free radicals via UV irradiation, charged particles in the upper atmosphere, etc. it is almost certainly going to be an ozone layer fucker. But really, what the fuck is the worry. An individual puff of one of the things is meant to deliver some 100mcg, one tenth of one thousandth part of 1g, and how much solvent is that going to need? not very much.

Although some of them use ethanol as the solvent now. (im assuming you meant the CFCs that is...I can't see carbon tetrachloride being used in medicine. It was once, a very, very very very long time ago, but it was being phased out of use even during the late 1800s, according to some medical/surgical/pharmaceutical treatises I have from that period. (heh you wouldn't bloody believe some of the things in use back then...Aconite, Conium (poison hemlock, the one that was used to off Socrates that is, not Circuta/Oenanthe spp.), plenty of lead, mercury, arsenic, phosphorus..and damn...the treatment :zombiefuck: for piles would be enough to give anyone second thoughts about ever sitting down again....nitric acid. Burn em off. Fun or what :P
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