Feminism, in its simplest form is about equality. So any normal feminist would be against sexism whether it's directed towards men OR women. Of coiurse you get asshole feminists who are very anti-men and see everything as sexist. But those are extremists.
Also, while I see your point about there being much worse stuff going on elsewhere (and I feel very strongly about that - particularly sexual minorities and children's rights, ie child marriage and FGM), I don't think that is ever reason to not both fighting the smaller problems in your own country
For example I often see people saying to gay people "don't complain - they'd kill you in Jamaica" or whatever. That doesn't mean you shouldn't fight for gay people to be able to get married, just becuase there's much worse issues for gay people elsewhere in the world
And the same goes for sexism. Sure, women in the UK and the US generally don't experience shit anyway NEAR as bad as women in other countries, but it would be lazy and inexcusable to settle for "almost equal but not quite" just because it's even less unequal elsewhere.
Legally, of course, women are generally equal in the West now. But there's still some social attitudes that, yes, need changing. You can complain that that means I'm trying to force my views on others. But I don't care really. I think racist and homophobic attitudes need changing as well. That's just how it is. You (not you personally) have the right to hold sexist or racist views. But I will fight for society to move away from those views.
I don't think that is ever reason to not both fighting the smaller problems in your own country
I do. I REALLY, REALLY do. In fact what is normally considered fighting "smaller examples" here in America is actually trying to establish a matriarchy, and make women better than men. They do not want equality here, dude. There is a VERY well established feminist organization here, with its tentacles in corporations, politics, and most universities. You don't get it.
No. It's about sex equality. The fact that that effectively means promoting equality for WOMEN, simply reflects the fact that it's the women who have been suffering from inequalities.
It's not about pushing women above men. Just like gay pride is not about gay being better than straight.
Feminism is only "about promoting women" in that it's clearly the women who've been in need of equality. Promoting men would have been kind of silly. It is not about "promoting" them ABOVE men. It is about equality, whether you like it or not
Personally I think the word is getting a bit out of date nowadays, especially since feminism applies for general gender equality. It's what catches some people off and make them think its "female orientated", when for the large part it really isn't
Wrong! Check out what American Feminists have to say about men in the Feminist movement. This isn't just some asshole's opinion. This is the consensus of leaders of their community. Some of them MALE!
Female feminists argue that men cannot be feminists simply because they are not women, cannot understand women's issues, and are collectively members of the class of oppressors against women. They claim that men are granted inherent privileges that prevent them from identifying with feminist struggles and thus make it impossible for them to identify with feminists.[26]
One idea supporting men's inclusion as 'feminists' is that excluding men from the feminist movement labels it as solely a female task, which could be argued to be sexist in itself. They[who?] assert that until men share equal responsibility for struggling to end sexism against women, the feminist movement will reflect the very sexist contradiction it wishes to eradicate.[23] The term 'profeminist' occupies the middle ground in this semantic debate, because it offers a degree of closeness to feminism without using the term itself. Also, the prefix 'pro' characterizes the term as more proactive and positive. There has been some debate regarding the use of the hyphen (identifying as a 'pro-feminist' as opposed to a profeminist) claiming that it distances the term too much from feminism proper.[22]
In other words, yeah we'll include you.. you bald ape. But you can't be called the same thing as us. That would debase our movement with penis. EQUALITY FOR ALL YAY
Most of what you write here is sensible and nothing to be argued against BUT Feminism is not about equality. It is about promoting women.Nothing more or less
Al is right, guys. You may not like him, but he's right. Feminism was ONCE about equality for all. Now its about PREFERENTIAL TREATMENT for "womyn", and putting all the penis persons in cages. You are reading this, and thinking "Oh geez here he goes again, he always likes to make things so extreme!" No, I tell you the truth without dousing it in sugar.
Lemme tell it like this. I'm talking about the actual Feminist "movement". I'm not talking about the few folks who want to make sure all girls AND guys get a fair shake. Individually. Without the massive political/education devouring industry "feminism" has become. Many of the people i'm talking about learn this shit from school. They wind up getting duped into taking a stupid gender studies class, and being the young impressionable dorks they are, buy into it. Many even get "feminist" careers. I'll provide some examples of these brainwashing assholes.
In this video, notice the eager young woman asking about "chivalrous" behavior and "how to react to it" of this ACCOMPLISHED GENDER STUDIES FEMINIST PROFESSOR.
And notice she goes into a non-committal spiel without actually explaining anything, but it sounds so fucking intelligent and sensitive. She still drops hints that men are inherently bad, implying that men are sending the message that they will "physically overpower you" when they open doors for women, and even mentions male children she's worked with. She markedly brings up children, trying to play to the instinct to protect them, and then brings up her book "THE WAR ON BOYS", and talks about brainwashing them too but leaves out the details.
She concludes by confirming that shes "not as bad as the extreme feminists" and talks about their merciless sensitivity workshops. Yeah I can tell she studied psychology.
HEY! TEACHER! LEAVE THOSE KIDS ALONE!
I don't think you guys understand this "movement" aspect of it. I believe I spoke with Bodie about this once because she knew about it already. She tried to join the "movement" apparently. This isn't a quote, can't remember exactly what she said, but she said something like "They're all money hungry <bunch of insults>".
The term "feminism" came about because it started at a time when women had huge inequalities. Made sense really.
Exactly. It once stood for elevating women and combatting the privileges men had. And it actually helped, since that actually was how things worked then. IT isn't now. Feminists now STILL stand for that, even though rights are pretty much equal. Nothing on the average is really stopping a woman from being a corporation CEO, or an astronaut, or what the fuck ever. No, the issues they attack are EQUAL PAY(although if they didn't quit mid career to raise children this would be a non-issue), or PAY FOR MY CASUAL SEX BUT ALSO STAY OUT OF MY WOMB(talking about paying for birth control, they can shut the fuck up, i'm not going to. I agree their fucking habits are none of my business.)
Feminists want special treatment, and even more privilege than they already have. Al is right about that.
I have not even mentioned the RACIST elements to the current feminist movement, aside from their hyperagressive sexism towards men. They also believe wholeheartedly in white guilt, and have a very special place reserved in hell, just for white males.
ponds from now on.