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Politics, Mature and taboo => Political Pundits => Topic started by: Yuri Bezmenov on January 08, 2018, 12:55:09 PM

Title: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Yuri Bezmenov on January 08, 2018, 12:55:09 PM
The  first one being, the one that 4 Ace Deal ignored in the previous debate. If you ban or restrict guns in one area, they will just be illegally imported from another. Ban guns in the US and they will just flood across the border from Mexico...  just like Mexicans.

Chicago brought in tough controls.  But the Republican states around it didn't.  So people get guns from the nearby uncontrolled states and they end up in Chicago.

See?  That's how logic works. Cause and effect.

You've actually stumbled upon a good argument without realizing it.

Let's take your logic to the next level.

Let's say the US passes strict gun control nationwide.

We have a border to the south that you Limeys don't have where we couldn't stop 12 million+ Mexicans from coming into our country. That's not to mention the millions of tons of illegal drugs that come across our southern border too. While were at it, we have millions of tons of drugs coming into the US from China. Yeah, we can't stop that either.

So how do you propose to stop guns from entering the US illegally, I'm gladly waiting for your answer.   ;)

He never replied, nor has anyone else on the other side of the argument.



Now here's the second trump card, "Ghost guns". Guns that are made with home made receivers that have no serial numbers that can't be traced or controlled by the government.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/ghost-guns-shooting-rancho-tehama-california/

Machinists like me can now make a small fortune by making receivers for sale out of my garage on a benchtop milling machine.

If I plop down the money for a sheet metal press, I can make high capacity magazines in my garage too.   8)
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Minister Of Silly Walks on January 08, 2018, 09:51:27 PM
In other words, if the United States were to implement sensible gun control, they would face the exact same problems that every other country with gun control faces.

F*ck! I never thought of that!!!
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Calandale on January 08, 2018, 09:55:16 PM
GPUAR has a point with the easy production though - and it's just going to get easier.


It's also not likely to stop with the kinds of guns which are easily available. Digital contraband
shan't be easy to fully prevent. If something isn't resolved about the base human nature,
shit's gonna hit the fan pretty hard.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Minister Of Silly Walks on January 08, 2018, 10:08:30 PM
GPUAR has a point with the easy production though - and it's just going to get easier.


It's also not likely to stop with the kinds of guns which are easily available. Digital contraband
shan't be easy to fully prevent. If something isn't resolved about the base human nature,
shit's gonna hit the fan pretty hard.

Exactly the same problems that every other country with sensible gun control will face.

In Australia we already have a situation where a determined person who wants to get their hands on a gun usually can. Most criminal gangs, for example, already have decent stockpiles of illegally obtained and unregistered firearms. This doesn't negate the benefits of gun control.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Yuri Bezmenov on January 08, 2018, 10:27:33 PM
In other words, if the United States were to implement sensible gun control, they would face the exact same problems that every other country with gun control faces.

F*ck! I never thought of that!!!

Uuum no.

In Australia, you're like, you know, on a fucking island and shit. It's a LOT easier to control your borders than it is in the US.

Also, your criminal gangs aren't nearly as large as ours nor do you have a significant black population.

Furthermore, you have neither an entrenched gun culture, nor a large firearms industry like the US has.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Calandale on January 08, 2018, 11:16:31 PM
GPUAR has a point with the easy production though - and it's just going to get easier.


It's also not likely to stop with the kinds of guns which are easily available. Digital contraband
shan't be easy to fully prevent. If something isn't resolved about the base human nature,
shit's gonna hit the fan pretty hard.

Exactly the same problems that every other country with sensible gun control will face.

In Australia we already have a situation where a determined person who wants to get their hands on a gun usually can. Most criminal gangs, for example, already have decent stockpiles of illegally obtained and unregistered firearms. This doesn't negate the benefits of gun control.


Will is different from has however. We have no idea what's going to happen when high quality homemades start becoming easy to put together.


Gun control's benefits have not been tested in that environment yet.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: odeon on January 09, 2018, 03:34:51 AM
In other words, if the United States were to implement sensible gun control, they would face the exact same problems that every other country with gun control faces.

F*ck! I never thought of that!!!

You know, the US is speshul.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Yuri Bezmenov on January 09, 2018, 08:15:30 AM
^ but still not as bad as Malmö.  :LOL:
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Jack on January 09, 2018, 11:14:44 PM
you're like, you know, on a fucking island and shit.
:laugh:
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Minister Of Silly Walks on January 10, 2018, 01:40:21 AM
Plenty of countries with land borders have sensible gun control.

In Australia you can already buy guns illegally. Criminal gangs have guns, but they tend to use them to settle scores rather than against the non-gang population. You can also make all sorts of offensive weapons already, but this is not a widespread practice because it's illegal and shit and you can get into a lot of trouble for making or having bombs and other homemade weapons.

The argument that new technologies will result in an explosion in the number of unregistered guns being made is similar to fears a few years back that the availability of high quality colour printers would result in uncontrollable widespread counterfeiting operations. How did that turn out? People who print fake money are traceable and are punished. People who illegally make guns at home... ditto.

Gun culture and a large (and influential) gun manufacturing industry... certainly unique to the United States, at least among first world countries. You guys want to keep your guns and keep shooting each other, that's fine by me. Just don't expect me to agree that it's a great idea.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: odeon on January 10, 2018, 02:32:30 AM
^ but still not as bad as Malmö.  :LOL:

I should plus you for spelling the name correctly.

OTOH, your point is kind of vague. Care to elaborate?
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Yuri Bezmenov on January 10, 2018, 12:23:11 PM
Plenty of countries with land borders have sensible gun control.

..and it's just as ineffective there, just look at France.

Quote
In Australia you can already buy guns illegally. Criminal gangs have guns, but they tend to use them to settle scores rather than against the non-gang population.

Dittos in the US, most of the murders are gang related. Almost 50% of firearm homicides are black men killing other black men.

 
Quote
You can also make all sorts of offensive weapons already, but this is not a widespread practice because it's illegal and shit and you can get into a lot of trouble for making or having bombs and other homemade weapons.

Again, this is the same as the US.

Quote
The argument that new technologies will result in an explosion in the number of unregistered guns being made is similar to fears a few years back that the availability of high quality colour printers would result in uncontrollable widespread counterfeiting operations. How did that turn out? People who print fake money are traceable and are punished. People who illegally make guns at home... ditto.

This is a piss poor comparison. In the case of counterfeit money, the criminal is giving it out to non-criminals where it is quickly discovered and some good police work can trace it back to its source. With guns, either the criminals keep them or they sell them to people they think they can trust. Since the distribution is so tight, it's difficult to trace where they came from since only one or two guns will be discovered at a time.

Quote
Gun culture and a large (and influential) gun manufacturing industry... certainly unique to the United States, at least among first world countries. You guys want to keep your guns and keep shooting each other, that's fine by me. Just don't expect me to agree that it's a great idea.

The overwhelming majority of legal gun owners don't shoot each other, the majority of shootings are criminals shooting other criminals.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Yuri Bezmenov on January 10, 2018, 12:27:37 PM
^ but still not as bad as Malmö.  :LOL:

I should plus you for spelling the name correctly.

OTOH, your point is kind of vague. Care to elaborate?

A vague point to respond in kind to your vague comment.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: odeon on January 10, 2018, 01:07:32 PM
Malmö, for all its flaws, is nothing like the US.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Yuri Bezmenov on January 10, 2018, 02:41:57 PM
From Wikipedia:

"According to a report published by academic researchers in 2017, shooting incidents with fatal outcomes are about 4 to 5 times as common in Sweden compared to neighbouring countries such as Germany and Norway when taking population size into account. The city with the highest prevalence of shootings was Malmö. The grave violence in the studied period also changed character, from criminal motorcycle gangs to city suburbs.[45][46] Sweden also stands out in having a low resolution rate (25%) for gun homicides compared to Germany and Finland at 90%."
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: odeon on January 11, 2018, 02:44:27 AM
I thought we were comparing Malmö with the US.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Walkie on January 11, 2018, 09:53:50 AM
I thought we were comparing Malmö with the US.
yep.   He's got you there, Scrap :LOL:

However, the mention of the place aroused my interst and so I checkeded it out on Wikipedia. Here's a passage fom there that neatly explains their high crime rate, IMO:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malm%C3%B6 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malm%C3%B6)
Quote
Although the transformation from a city with its economic base in manufacturing has returned growth to Malmö, the new types of jobs have largely benefited the middle and upper classes. While the inner city becomes gentrified and the upper-middle class have settled the Western Harbour, little has changed for the inhabitants of the districts of the Million Programme; Malmö remains a city of sharp social divides and high unemployment.
Now, isn't it well-known that criminal gangs tend to arise amongst the socially deprived? I do very much agree with gun control legislation, but it looks to me like the more equal  distribution if wealth would  reduce gun crime (as well as other crime) a whole lot more effectively that restricting   access to guns would.

But the 1% consider that  too high a price for the to pay, I suppose.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Yuri Bezmenov on January 11, 2018, 03:47:05 PM
Now, isn't it well-known that criminal gangs tend to arise amongst the socially deprived?

No. The most socially deprived Americans are poor rural whites in Appalachia, no gangs there and very little crime.

Quote
I do very much agree with gun control legislation,

Do gun triggers pull themselves??

Quote
but it looks to me like the more equal  distribution if wealth would  reduce gun crime (as well as other crime) a whole lot more effectively that restricting   access to guns would.

There's a certain degree of truth to this. It isn't necessarily poverty that causes crime, it's the uneven distribution of wealth in urban areas that are statistically linked to higher crime rates. Uruguay and Paraguay for example, are relatively poor countries with low crime rates.

Quote
But the 1% consider that  too high a price for the to pay, I suppose.

The 1% largely only care about their own interests.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: odeon on January 12, 2018, 02:45:53 AM
I thought we were comparing Malmö with the US.
yep.   He's got you there, Scrap :LOL:

However, the mention of the place aroused my interst and so I checkeded it out on Wikipedia. Here's a passage fom there that neatly explains their high crime rate, IMO:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malm%C3%B6 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malm%C3%B6)
Quote
Although the transformation from a city with its economic base in manufacturing has returned growth to Malmö, the new types of jobs have largely benefited the middle and upper classes. While the inner city becomes gentrified and the upper-middle class have settled the Western Harbour, little has changed for the inhabitants of the districts of the Million Programme; Malmö remains a city of sharp social divides and high unemployment.
Now, isn't it well-known that criminal gangs tend to arise amongst the socially deprived? I do very much agree with gun control legislation, but it looks to me like the more equal  distribution if wealth would  reduce gun crime (as well as other crime) a whole lot more effectively that restricting   access to guns would.

But the 1% consider that  too high a price for the to pay, I suppose.

The causes (in Malmö) are indeed considered to be well known but not sufficiently addressed. It's been a rather frequent discussion in the Swedish media, especially since the ManUtd striker, Zlatan Ibrahimovic, is from one of the, um, affected areas.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Minister Of Silly Walks on January 12, 2018, 03:18:26 AM
Cherry picked statistics are largely meaningless and are often used to misrepresent what is really happening. Some areas have much higher crime rates than other areas in the same country. If you want a meaningful comparison, maybe you could compare Malmö to Detroit?

With all its problems, with very high levels of immigration from countries whose dangerous citizens the US won't even let through immigration, Sweden only has about a quarter the rate of murders per capita that the US has. France, with its land borders, has about a third of the per-capita murder rate that the US has.

I was going to look up some stats and list out some comparisons but, lucky for me, someone already did it  :santa::

https://www.aftonbladet.se/nyheter/a/WP0KG/the-crime-situation-in-sweden-compared-to-the-us-in-4-charts

Probably some intellectually dishonest Social Justice Warrior from the Frankfurt School of Cultural Marxism. :tinfoil:
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: odeon on January 12, 2018, 02:16:41 PM
Cherry picked statistics are largely meaningless and are often used to misrepresent what is really happening. Some areas have much higher crime rates than other areas in the same country. If you want a meaningful comparison, maybe you could compare Malmö to Detroit?

It's as they say, all relative. Comparing Malmö to the US is at best dishonest.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Yuri Bezmenov on January 18, 2018, 07:57:28 PM
The causes (in Malmö) are indeed considered to be well known but not sufficiently addressed.

Yeah, too many Dune Coons.  :M
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: odeon on January 19, 2018, 01:39:43 AM
The causes (in Malmö) are indeed considered to be well known but not sufficiently addressed.

Yeah, too many Dune Coons.  :M

Bigots will be bigots. :M
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Yuri Bezmenov on March 06, 2018, 06:20:08 PM
The causes (in Malmö) are indeed considered to be well known but not sufficiently addressed.

Yeah, too many Dune Coons.  :M

Bigots will be bigots. :M

I agree, Dune Coons are bigots in addition to being rapists (Malmö IS the rape capitol of Europe) and criminal thugs.

We don't have the problem here of people throwing hand grenades at police stations or hand grenade attacks in general, unlike Sweden.   :hahaha:

Oh, I almost forgot, we don't have criminal gangs that shoot up police stations with full automatic AK-47's (an ACTUAL Assault Rifle). either.   :hahaha:
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: odeon on March 07, 2018, 02:23:13 AM
36 Swedes will not die in gun-related deaths today. What are the numbers like over there?
45,000 Swedes will not die this year because of lack of insurance. What are the numbers like over there?

Do you ever wonder why so many people see you as a joke, Scrap?
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Arya Quinn on March 07, 2018, 05:08:29 PM
36 Swedes will not die in gun-related deaths today. What are the numbers like over there?
45,000 Swedes will not die this year because of lack of insurance. What are the numbers like over there?

Do you ever wonder why so many people see you as a joke, Scrap?

I think he's too busy 'negging us and posting incoherent shit disguised as piss-poor arguments to see it. It'd be hilarious if it didn't remind me of work, seeing a man older than myself losing his marbles possibly due to early dementia or some other kind of illness.  :M
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Yuri Bezmenov on March 07, 2018, 05:51:07 PM
36 Swedes will not die in gun-related deaths today. What are the numbers like over there?

Roughly 33.

Half of those will be black people killing other black people.

Hispanics also make up a disproportionate percentage of that number.

What you're left with is murder rates comparable to Europe as a whole.

Violent crime follows the racial lines of the parent populations, the FBI has known this for decades now.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Al Swearegen on March 07, 2018, 06:59:43 PM
What is this about hand grenade attacks? Who, where and why?
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Yuri Bezmenov on March 07, 2018, 09:13:36 PM
What is this about hand grenade attacks? Who, where and why?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_grenade_attacks_in_Sweden


They get more hand grenade attacks in a year than the US does in a decade.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Gopher Gary on March 07, 2018, 10:05:19 PM
They should make grenades illegal.  :zoinks:
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: odeon on March 08, 2018, 01:31:52 AM
36 Swedes will not die in gun-related deaths today. What are the numbers like over there?

Roughly 33.

Half of those will be black people killing other black people.

Hispanics also make up a disproportionate percentage of that number.

What you're left with is murder rates comparable to Europe as a whole.

Violent crime follows the racial lines of the parent populations, the FBI has known this for decades now.

Brilliantly argued.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: El on March 13, 2018, 11:22:13 AM
36 Swedes will not die in gun-related deaths today. What are the numbers like over there?

Roughly 33.

Half of those will be black people killing other black people.

Hispanics also make up a disproportionate percentage of that number.

What you're left with is murder rates comparable to Europe as a whole.

Violent crime follows the racial lines of the parent populations, the FBI has known this for decades now.

Brilliantly argued.
I'm not actually sure what point he was even trying to argue.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Yuri Bezmenov on March 13, 2018, 02:08:14 PM
I'm not actually sure what point he was even trying to argue.

That gun violence rates (and violent crime in general) strongly correlate along racial lines.

Legal gun ownership rates have no direct correlation to gun violence, many criminals get guns illegally anyways.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: El on March 13, 2018, 02:27:15 PM
I'm not actually sure what point he was even trying to argue.

That gun violence rates (and violent crime in general) strongly correlate along racial lines.

Legal gun ownership rates have no direct correlation to gun violence, many criminals get guns illegally anyways.
No, I mean, what are you proposing as a response to this interpretation of the data?
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Yuri Bezmenov on March 13, 2018, 02:35:46 PM
I'm not actually sure what point he was even trying to argue.

That gun violence rates (and violent crime in general) strongly correlate along racial lines.

Legal gun ownership rates have no direct correlation to gun violence, many criminals get guns illegally anyways.
No, I mean, what are you proposing as a response to this interpretation of the data?

Because of the demographic differences between Sweden and the US.

How much do you want to bet that the gun violence rates amongst Scandinavians living in the US (like in Minnesota and Wisconsin) are comparable to gun violence rates in Scandinavian countries (minus the muslim populations of course)??
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: El on March 13, 2018, 03:54:09 PM
I'm not actually sure what point he was even trying to argue.

That gun violence rates (and violent crime in general) strongly correlate along racial lines.

Legal gun ownership rates have no direct correlation to gun violence, many criminals get guns illegally anyways.
No, I mean, what are you proposing as a response to this interpretation of the data?

Because of the demographic differences between Sweden and the US.

How much do you want to bet that the gun violence rates amongst Scandinavians living in the US (like in Minnesota and Wisconsin) are comparable to gun violence rates in Scandinavian countries (minus the muslim populations of course)??
OK, but what do you propose as a response to this interpretation of the data?
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Lestat on March 14, 2018, 07:13:41 AM
The only crime associated with tossing grenades into a cop shop, or shooting one up is if someone gets caught doing it. Oh, and missing shots. Unless of course someone is intending not to kill the pig they have in their crosshairs, but rather to inflict a wound of the kind  that will leave them crippled   and  in agony for the rest of their filthy lying donut scoffing days, until all that donut fat atrophies away due to being confined to a wheelchair and fed through a  tube in the stomach, or at least the bits of it that shotgun blast didn't spatter liberally over the nearest wall, and they waste away and  die  slowly and miserably.

Fucking bastards.

As for  gangs  in the likes  of  appalachia, I'll bet there are plenty of meth ops, although with tighter restrictions on PSE (not sure what the local state regulations are in that particular state with regards to PSE and  eph) I doubt they could come close to competing with the mexican cartels, and if  making in bulk it'd not be the D-meth from eph/pseudo reductions, but racemic product via reduction of P2NP made via knoevanagel condensation.)

Thats the kind of  thing, producing for self  use and local distribution though thats  likely to come as a  consequence of deprivation, social inequality. And the folks slinging the crystal are going to be wanting to protect their interests, likely as not at the end of a gunsight.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Lestat on March 14, 2018, 08:41:45 AM
https://www.theboxotruth.com/educational-zone-116-carters-first-birthday-and-his-first-rifle/

Damn, says it all.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Yuri Bezmenov on March 14, 2018, 08:50:19 AM
I'm not actually sure what point he was even trying to argue.

That gun violence rates (and violent crime in general) strongly correlate along racial lines.

Legal gun ownership rates have no direct correlation to gun violence, many criminals get guns illegally anyways.
No, I mean, what are you proposing as a response to this interpretation of the data?

Because of the demographic differences between Sweden and the US.

How much do you want to bet that the gun violence rates amongst Scandinavians living in the US (like in Minnesota and Wisconsin) are comparable to gun violence rates in Scandinavian countries (minus the muslim populations of course)??
OK, but what do you propose as a response to this interpretation of the data?

First of all, an acknowledgement of reality of what the source of the problem actually is. Quit punishing law abiding gun owners for the actions of black thug culture and a handful of mental cases.

Second, incrementally dismantle the welfare state. The Stanford economist Thomas Sowell figured this out decades ago. He said that nothing has been more harmful to the black family than welfare because it replaces black men with the government as the primary bread winner in black families. This gives black men too much free time on their hands to form gangs and get into trouble. It also enables black women to be ratchet hoes and crap out more thugs. It's a vicious cycle.

Then you need to crack down on Mexican drug gangs and MS13. Blacks and Hispanics are the two largest sources of murder in the US.

Last, you need to fix the broken health care system. Almost every one of these mass shooters has shown prior mentel health problems and also most of them have been on anti-psychotic drugs. The anti-psychotic drugs are probably the main problem. I knew someone who became a mass shooter, Lee Leeds. He was given a new prescription of psych meds before he lost his shit and killed 4 people.

http://www.santamariasun.com/news/8536/leeds-will-spend-the-rest-of-his-life-in-prison--for-scrap-yard-killings/

Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: odeon on March 15, 2018, 02:34:55 AM
Because of the demographic differences between Sweden and the US.

How much do you want to bet that the gun violence rates amongst Scandinavians living in the US (like in Minnesota and Wisconsin) are comparable to gun violence rates in Scandinavian countries (minus the muslim populations of course)??

This is about as stupid as it gets.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Lestat on March 15, 2018, 05:57:23 AM
Thats not  an argument for not  having a welfare system in place as a safety net, some people genuinely can't work, through illness, injury etc. and there needs to be some  provision in place.

Baby-factory blacks, white trailor trash, hispanics etc. who suck at the state tit as a lifestyle option, they just need to be told 'get out and get a job you lazy nigger'.

And of course cracking down not just on the mexi-mafia groups, but stamping on the locally-resident gangs of niggers, whether they are black or not. At least the big, organized dangerous groups, as opposed to a few niggers banding together. The criminal syndicates known to be involved in violent crime.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: El on March 15, 2018, 06:08:41 AM
Because of the demographic differences between Sweden and the US.

How much do you want to bet that the gun violence rates amongst Scandinavians living in the US (like in Minnesota and Wisconsin) are comparable to gun violence rates in Scandinavian countries (minus the muslim populations of course)??

This is about as stupid as it gets.
But did you read his most recent post?

*sigh*
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Al Swearegen on March 15, 2018, 07:12:51 AM
Because of the demographic differences between Sweden and the US.

How much do you want to bet that the gun violence rates amongst Scandinavians living in the US (like in Minnesota and Wisconsin) are comparable to gun violence rates in Scandinavian countries (minus the muslim populations of course)??

This is about as stupid as it gets.
But did you read his most recent post?

*sigh*

I doubt it
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Yuri Bezmenov on March 15, 2018, 07:13:14 AM
Because of the demographic differences between Sweden and the US.

How much do you want to bet that the gun violence rates amongst Scandinavians living in the US (like in Minnesota and Wisconsin) are comparable to gun violence rates in Scandinavian countries (minus the muslim populations of course)??

This is about as stupid as it gets.

This is according to the FBI, but what the fuck do they know about crime huh??

Obviously internet wankers from Scandinavia know far more about crime statistics than actual criminologists because PC.

The FBI data follows a predictable Pareto distribution, like most other human phenomenon, but this is obviously wrong because all races commit violent crime in the exact same percentages because Pareto distributions are racist obviously.   :tard:
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Yuri Bezmenov on March 15, 2018, 07:17:44 AM
Because of the demographic differences between Sweden and the US.

How much do you want to bet that the gun violence rates amongst Scandinavians living in the US (like in Minnesota and Wisconsin) are comparable to gun violence rates in Scandinavian countries (minus the muslim populations of course)??

This is about as stupid as it gets.
But did you read his most recent post?

*sigh*

Oh, yes. the world renown Stanford economist, Thomas Sowell is a total idiot and doesn't know the first thing about what he's talking about but PMS Elle and odeot are experts on the challenges faced by black Americans.

Totally makes sense.   :tard:
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Yuri Bezmenov on March 15, 2018, 07:21:03 AM
Thats not  an argument for not  having a welfare system in place as a safety net, some people genuinely can't work, through illness, injury etc. and there needs to be some  provision in place.

I think most people would agree with this.

Quote
Baby-factory blacks, white trailor trash, hispanics etc. who suck at the state tit as a lifestyle option, they just need to be told 'get out and get a job you lazy nigger'.

Yeah, pretty much. We need to quit subsidizing degenerates.

Quote
And of course cracking down not just on the mexi-mafia groups, but stamping on the locally-resident gangs of niggers, whether they are black or not. At least the big, organized dangerous groups, as opposed to a few niggers banding together. The criminal syndicates known to be involved in violent crime.

The problem in today's PC world is that you can't do this without being labeled a racist.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: odeon on March 15, 2018, 11:45:33 AM
Because of the demographic differences between Sweden and the US.

How much do you want to bet that the gun violence rates amongst Scandinavians living in the US (like in Minnesota and Wisconsin) are comparable to gun violence rates in Scandinavian countries (minus the muslim populations of course)??

This is about as stupid as it gets.
But did you read his most recent post?

*sigh*

Yeah, unfortunately. I did write "about as stupid as it gets", though.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: odeon on March 15, 2018, 11:53:27 AM
Because of the demographic differences between Sweden and the US.

How much do you want to bet that the gun violence rates amongst Scandinavians living in the US (like in Minnesota and Wisconsin) are comparable to gun violence rates in Scandinavian countries (minus the muslim populations of course)??

This is about as stupid as it gets.
But did you read his most recent post?

*sigh*

Oh, yes. the world renown Stanford economist, Thomas Sowell is a total idiot and doesn't know the first thing about what he's talking about but PMS Elle and odeot are experts on the challenges faced by black Americans.

Totally makes sense.   :tard:

(https://pics.conservativememes.com/pat-bagley-patbagley-list-of-when-countries-adopted-universal-healthcare-21555538.png)

Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Yuri Bezmenov on March 15, 2018, 12:09:11 PM
Non-sequitur.   :M
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Lestat on March 15, 2018, 02:43:18 PM
Scrap-my point was that the only skin  requirement to being  a dirty fucking scrounging nigger piece of  shit, is HAVING a skin, whatever  it looks like.

I've (regrettably) met  enough of the bastards who's skin is as white as mine is, and they were still fucking niggers that should have been shot in the face for the good of humanity.

Black nigger, white nigger, camelfucking nigger, same shit, just different stinks in the nonwhite cases. And more propensity to the koransturbating  pigfucking  paedophile-worshippers blowing themselves up than the white or black varieties of nigger.

The remark about welfare reminds me of a somewhat off color joke. ''how do  you force a nigger to starve to death?'  'hide his benefit check under a pair of work boots''
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Yuri Bezmenov on March 15, 2018, 02:52:50 PM
Scrap-my point was that the only skin  requirement to being  a dirty fucking scrounging nigger piece of  shit, is HAVING a skin, whatever  it looks like.

I've (regrettably) met  enough of the bastards who's skin is as white as mine is, and they were still fucking niggers that should have been shot in the face for the good of humanity.

Black nigger, white nigger, camelfucking nigger, same shit, just different stinks in the nonwhite cases. And more propensity to the koransturbating  pigfucking  paedophile-worshippers blowing themselves up than the white or black varieties of nigger.

The remark about welfare reminds me of a somewhat off color joke. ''how do  you force a nigger to starve to death?'  'hide his benefit check under a pair of work boots''

These things do tend to travel along racial lines though. Not because of the DNA itself but rather the cultures that follow these racial groups.

"Black culture" in the USA has largely imploded since the 1960's and now they are largely part of the dependency class in the US.

There are 3 things in life that you must do to escape permanent poverty in life and black people in the US, for the most part don't do these 3 things.

The 3 things are: 1) Graduate High School, 2) Don't have kids until you're married, 3) Get a job and keep it.

"Black culture" looks down at these things and instead celebrates being a thug. Not exactly a recipe for success in the modern world.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Arya Quinn on March 15, 2018, 03:57:28 PM
Because of the demographic differences between Sweden and the US.

How much do you want to bet that the gun violence rates amongst Scandinavians living in the US (like in Minnesota and Wisconsin) are comparable to gun violence rates in Scandinavian countries (minus the muslim populations of course)??

This is about as stupid as it gets.
But did you read his most recent post?

*sigh*

Oh, yes. the world renown Stanford economist, Thomas Sowell is a total idiot and doesn't know the first thing about what he's talking about but PMS Elle and odeot are experts on the challenges faced by black Americans.

Totally makes sense.   :tard:

(https://pics.conservativememes.com/pat-bagley-patbagley-list-of-when-countries-adopted-universal-healthcare-21555538.png)

UK's scrapping it, just for different reasons.  :headhurts:
Fucking Tories.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Minister Of Silly Walks on March 15, 2018, 07:55:35 PM
Thats not  an argument for not  having a welfare system in place as a safety net, some people genuinely can't work, through illness, injury etc. and there needs to be some  provision in place.

I think most people would agree with this.

Quote
Baby-factory blacks, white trailor trash, hispanics etc. who suck at the state tit as a lifestyle option, they just need to be told 'get out and get a job you lazy nigger'.

Yeah, pretty much. We need to quit subsidizing degenerates.

Quote
And of course cracking down not just on the mexi-mafia groups, but stamping on the locally-resident gangs of niggers, whether they are black or not. At least the big, organized dangerous groups, as opposed to a few niggers banding together. The criminal syndicates known to be involved in violent crime.

The problem in today's PC world is that you can't do this without being labeled a racist.

You couldn't make up satire half that funny.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: odeon on March 16, 2018, 01:46:16 AM
It's mostly sad, actually.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Lestat on March 16, 2018, 03:19:37 AM
Scrap,in the US  it sounds like it  does, there seems  to be a  lot of institutionalized racism in the  pigs and  court system, where  ethnics of whatever  variety, although  particularly (it seems, at least, what with the disproportionate number of non-judicial killings of unarmed  black people by the filth) targeted at blacks there (personally I think the term 'african  american' as a default title for the black american population is more than a bit dumb, since the vast majority of them won't ever have been within half an ocean or flight-path of the african continent  and thus aren't connected  to africa directly themselves. Ancestors way back, yes,  some more recently as slaves, but your average black person in the US probably has very little to do with africa  and it makes little sense calling blacks living in the US 'african americans'), and  more likely not only to be arrested, but to  be convicted, whether they did whatever they were accused of or not.

And once that happens,  likely as not, its going to turn them into a product for the prison market, in and out and  in and out etc., revolving-door syndrome, and not in the least unthinkably, turn those who started out as black people into black niggers, not necessarily, probably perhaps not even likely, by choice, but out of a mixture  of being packed into cages  with criminal underworld  figures of various stripes, plenty of thugs  and gangbangers, and knowing they won't be able to get a job when they get out, and without the potential to get a job and earn money, they have to get  money somehow, or  else either end up on the streets, or starve. The die is already cast in big racks, awaiting only something to pour in and freeze in place. The gangs of thug niggers, white or black aren't going to give a fuck about a resume or whether someone has convictions on file, hell its probably a selling point if they do.

So it looks  to me  like turning black  people into niggers  is profitable for the US  government. Fucking privatized prison  system they have  there is a  monstrous abomination. ANY private prison system is a rotten one, right to the core. Because there  being a financial interest in having a demand for a quota or supply of inmates makes there become born, a vested interest in targeting  the easiest groups, and the ones already most likely to become criminals for societal reasons become even more so  for reasons  directly related to the prison system itself.

Justice, real justice cannot be monetized and remain justice.

And also, it'd strike me as more than likely for it to become  a  self-perpetuating resource. Nigger-creation that is. Once the US govt. and their privatized prison system has removed their means  of earning, and of, if they go onto the benefit system as opposed to turning to crime, earning any respect, which they have the chance to from gang membership. Not necessarily for good reasons, probably pretty bad ones in most individual instances,  but they can seek and obtain it nevertheless,  from fellow gangbangers.

Also, if that wasn't enough, what non-crooked person, who has never been to prison for a convicted sentence, etc.,  the nonviolent people in  the US, why would  the people in work, living a non-thuggish honest life ever want to hook up with a nigger of any color? they aren't, are they? nobody wants a feckless father of kid after kid that the father doesn't give a fuck about from 5 different mothers, who is a gangbanger and a violent thug  for a partner.

So where do newly-created niggers have to go for a partner? other niggers, redneck hicks going for other redneck trailer trash white nigger redneck hicks, and once that happens, what else is going to happen? they  are going to breed more fodder for the prison market, that is even MORE likely than the original ever was, to end up a nigger, because  their parents are niggers and potentially, have older siblings already in daddy's gang.

One ugly fucker of a vicious circle.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: El on March 16, 2018, 05:32:22 AM
It's mostly sad, actually.
Or horrifying, if you're in America, and people who believe this shit are running the fucking country now.

It's like a nightmare you can't wake up from.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Al Swearegen on March 16, 2018, 06:36:39 AM
Who and what policy specifically are you talking about? Seems like a bit of a "I feel" kind of argument or "I think X thinks Y and on that basis they must be Z"

Look I get the attraction of the argument that Liberal (read Progressive) views are better than Conservative AND that Conservative views are evil and immoral and therefore racist and a path to pure Neo-Nazi apologia and death camps to all people who are gay, black, or immigrants BUT I think as ideologically supportive of righteously indignant narratives as these thoughts are, most people (and this includes those running this country), do not think like that.

Not to say that this gives Trump a free pass. Guy would probably ban vaccines if he had his way and not all his ideas nor his cabinet are great. But when you say he thinks something terrible when it is not at all clear that he thinks this at all, it becomes a little derailing especially when someone like me writes a rambling semi-coherent counter to this.

It is absolutely true that American blacks vote predominately for Democrats and this was not always the case. They switched over from the party that freed them from slavery to the Democrats in the 1930's predominately and look how the Democrats treated them through the 1930's -1960's. So the Big switch is a Big con. It makes as much sense as two opposing sports teams switching jumpers mid game and playing for their opposing team.

Democrats get a lot of undeserved purchase in denouncing all Conservatives as racist. I have seen nothing to indicate this is in any significant way true. I am sure Democrats are equally as racist in equal numbers



Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Al Swearegen on March 16, 2018, 06:38:18 AM
Because of the demographic differences between Sweden and the US.

How much do you want to bet that the gun violence rates amongst Scandinavians living in the US (like in Minnesota and Wisconsin) are comparable to gun violence rates in Scandinavian countries (minus the muslim populations of course)??

This is about as stupid as it gets.
But did you read his most recent post?

*sigh*

Oh, yes. the world renown Stanford economist, Thomas Sowell is a total idiot and doesn't know the first thing about what he's talking about but PMS Elle and odeot are experts on the challenges faced by black Americans.

Totally makes sense.   :tard:

I like Thomas Sowell. Very switched on guy.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: odeon on March 16, 2018, 07:07:07 AM
Look I get the attraction of the argument that Liberal (read Progressive) views are better than Conservative AND that Conservative views are evil and immoral and therefore racist and a path to pure Neo-Nazi apologia and death camps to all people who are gay, black, or immigrants BUT I think as ideologically supportive of righteously indignant narratives as these thoughts are, most people (and this includes those running this country), do not think like that.

Honestly, is this what you think the argument is? And if not, whatever made you write this shit?
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Yuri Bezmenov on March 16, 2018, 07:15:44 PM
It's mostly sad, actually.

I agree.

The cops didn't go after this rape gang because they didn't want to be called racist.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rotherham_child_sexual_exploitation_scandal
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Yuri Bezmenov on March 16, 2018, 07:18:49 PM
Scrap,in the US  it sounds like it  does, there seems  to be a  lot of institutionalized racism in the  pigs and  court system, where  ethnics of whatever  variety, although  particularly (it seems, at least, what with the disproportionate number of non-judicial killings of unarmed  black people by the filth) targeted at blacks there (personally I think the term 'african  american' as a default title for the black american population is more than a bit dumb, since the vast majority of them won't ever have been within half an ocean or flight-path of the african continent  and thus aren't connected  to africa directly themselves. Ancestors way back, yes,  some more recently as slaves, but your average black person in the US probably has very little to do with africa  and it makes little sense calling blacks living in the US 'african americans'), and  more likely not only to be arrested, but to  be convicted, whether they did whatever they were accused of or not.

This sounds like the propaganda about the US that you get in Europe.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Yuri Bezmenov on March 16, 2018, 07:21:49 PM
It's mostly sad, actually.
Or horrifying, if you're in America, and people who believe this shit are running the fucking country now.

It's like a nightmare you can't wake up from.

You mean people who won't listen to you and instead listen to people who know WTF they're talking about??  People like... Thomas Sowell.  :M
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Yuri Bezmenov on March 16, 2018, 07:23:56 PM
I like Thomas Sowell. Very switched on guy.

 :thumbup:

Me too. Very well educated and knows his facts, unlike odeot and Elle.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Lestat on March 16, 2018, 10:05:59 PM
That 'UK propaganda', isn't. Its a summation of a lot of posts by americans on another forum. I'd sooner not say which one, since I wouldn't wish to potentially make it easier to track me either
here or there though.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: odeon on March 17, 2018, 01:35:42 AM
I like Thomas Sowell. Very switched on guy.

 :thumbup:

Me too. Very well educated and knows his facts, unlike odeot and Elle.

You pick your heroes well: https://townhall.com/columnists/thomassowell/2007/03/15/global-warming-swindle-n1176180

Quote from: Sowell
"Global warming" is just the latest in a long line of hysterical crusades to which we seem to be increasingly susceptible.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: benjimanbreeg on March 17, 2018, 04:53:25 PM
I like Thomas Sowell. Very switched on guy.

 :thumbup:

Me too. Very well educated and knows his facts, unlike odeot and Elle.

You pick your heroes well: https://townhall.com/columnists/thomassowell/2007/03/15/global-warming-swindle-n1176180

Quote from: Sowell
"Global warming" is just the latest in a long line of hysterical crusades to which we seem to be increasingly susceptible.

Sowell is right about that though.  The propaganda is hysterical.  It's 'global warming' when it gets warmer but back to "climate change" when there's floods or freezing temperatures. 

Trouble is, we ate destroying the planet.  The corrupt politicians that fly to conferences in private jets to warn us all about it don't help anyone.  They don't give a shit about the climate.  Onshore wind farms are fucking useless.  Their solutions don't work and they don't care.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: odeon on March 18, 2018, 03:43:20 AM
So you're saying that Sowell is right but we are destroying the planet?

Hilarious.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Minister Of Silly Walks on March 25, 2018, 12:28:21 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PNXXiHl9dWE

Powerful statement. Backed up with facts and shit.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Minister Of Silly Walks on March 25, 2018, 12:33:51 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pSwEq8Pym8k

Pack of bloody snowflake SJWs the lot of them.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Jack on March 25, 2018, 03:46:06 AM
facts and shit.
Milwaukee has a historical gang problem. While the state of Wisconsin crime trends fall below the national average, the city of Milwaukee has long stood out above both. The city has seen similar declining trends to the rest of the country for property crime, but has experienced a mirror opposite to the nation for violent crime, with rates three times the national average and four times the state average. This article is light reading and has nice graphs. https://www.cityrating.com/crime-statistics/wisconsin/milwaukee.html This article also has nice graphs and suggests the rise in Milwaukee shootings is entirely attributed to race. https://urbanmilwaukee.com/2016/06/16/data-wonk-possible-solutions-to-murder-in-milwaukee/ Don't generally toss racial stats into crime discussions, but this one is alarming. Though mostly liked the second article because it confirms my babyboomer theory is apparently supported by other people, and it will provoke pappy. :laugh: Cities are allowed to have stricter gun laws than the state level, so instead of shaking their fists at state permit laws, Milwaukee could do something about their own laws. They could also seek guidance from other cities like Los Angeles and New York, which have experienced remarkable success rates in reducing gang related violence through community outreach.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Yuri Bezmenov on March 27, 2018, 05:13:44 PM
Ahem!!   :comrade:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fPVvqZi4P5Y
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: odeon on March 27, 2018, 11:33:32 PM
https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2013/01/pro-gun-myths-fact-check/
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Minister Of Silly Walks on March 28, 2018, 12:04:11 AM
Ahem!!   :comrade:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fPVvqZi4P5Y

Is that how rapists operate in your neck of the woods?

Knock knock
Who's there?
Your friendly neighbourhood rapist!
Your friendly neighbourhood racist who?
Your friendly neighbourhood rapist who's gonna give you 5 minutes to go get your gun before loudly bursting, unarmed, through your front door.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Arya Quinn on March 28, 2018, 08:35:14 AM
Ahem!!   :comrade:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fPVvqZi4P5Y

Is that how rapists operate in your neck of the woods?

Knock knock
Who's there?
Your friendly neighbourhood rapist!
Your friendly neighbourhood racist who?
Your friendly neighbourhood rapist who's gonna give you 5 minutes to go get your gun before loudly bursting, unarmed, through your front door.

If only all those young Catholic boys had guns.  :tinfoil:
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: odeon on March 28, 2018, 11:46:33 PM
Ahem!!   :comrade:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fPVvqZi4P5Y

Is that how rapists operate in your neck of the woods?

Knock knock
Who's there?
Your friendly neighbourhood rapist!
Your friendly neighbourhood racist who?
Your friendly neighbourhood rapist who's gonna give you 5 minutes to go get your gun before loudly bursting, unarmed, through your front door.

I'm not sure a more realistic scenario would sell any guns. :P
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: El on March 29, 2018, 05:52:08 AM
I'm not sure a more realistic scenario would sell any guns. :P
You just summed up a significant amount of the conversation around guns in the U.S.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: odeon on March 29, 2018, 08:06:56 AM
I'm not sure a more realistic scenario would sell any guns. :P
You just summed up a significant amount of the conversation around guns in the U.S.

That bad?
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Jack on March 29, 2018, 05:46:22 PM
"racist who?" :laugh:
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: El on March 29, 2018, 06:59:48 PM
I'm not sure a more realistic scenario would sell any guns. :P
You just summed up a significant amount of the conversation around guns in the U.S.

That bad?
Jesus fuck, yeah. 

And a lot of it feels like obsessive planning around how to handle one particular moment, without though of what happens after that moment (i.e., you have shot someone, how will now have to deal with the legal ramifications of having shot someone- WHETHER OR NOT IT WAS "SELF DEFENSE."  And it will be hell for you EVEN IF YOU WIN YOUR CASE.  Which you PROBABLY WON'T.)

At this point, the pro-gun defenses that make the most sense to me are preppers (it at least makes sense on its own logic) and people planning to suicide with the gun (also makes sense on its own logic, but that's not going to be widely argued on the 'pro' side anytime soon).  Most other arguments just don't hold water for me.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: odeon on March 30, 2018, 01:58:08 AM
I'm not sure a more realistic scenario would sell any guns. :P
You just summed up a significant amount of the conversation around guns in the U.S.

That bad?
Jesus fuck, yeah. 

And a lot of it feels like obsessive planning around how to handle one particular moment, without though of what happens after that moment (i.e., you have shot someone, how will now have to deal with the legal ramifications of having shot someone- WHETHER OR NOT IT WAS "SELF DEFENSE."  And it will be hell for you EVEN IF YOU WIN YOUR CASE.  Which you PROBABLY WON'T.)

At this point, the pro-gun defenses that make the most sense to me are preppers (it at least makes sense on its own logic) and people planning to suicide with the gun (also makes sense on its own logic, but that's not going to be widely argued on the 'pro' side anytime soon).  Most other arguments just don't hold water for me.

A suicide commercial in the same style as this one could be... different. :laugh:
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Yuri Bezmenov on August 20, 2018, 06:14:46 AM
And a lot of it feels like obsessive planning around how to handle one particular moment, without though of what happens after that moment (i.e., you have shot someone, how will now have to deal with the legal ramifications of having shot someone- WHETHER OR NOT IT WAS "SELF DEFENSE."  And it will be hell for you EVEN IF YOU WIN YOUR CASE.  Which you PROBABLY WON'T.)

SO fucking what?? Tha alternative to that would be to be D-E-A-D DEAD!

Haven't you ever heard the saying that it's better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6??

How stupid do you have to be to make an argument that you shouldn't kill in self defense because you will probably be tried for it??

Who do you think you are, mdagli1??   :hahaha:
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: Lestat on August 20, 2018, 07:00:59 AM
Elle might not have it right on that one, but you can hardly place her and  our former pencil-dicked mentally bent 'friend' in the same sort of categories.

When elle spends time with the mentally twisted and/or fucked, at least it isn't another personality crawling out of the woodwork as with mcfagly. Although granted his alternate personalities more or less were limited to 'secondary dickweasel' and  'tertiary dickweasel'. Rather one-dimensional in their devotion to weaselly dick-ness.
Title: Re: The other trump card in the gun debate.
Post by: odeon on August 20, 2018, 01:48:06 PM
When elle spends time with the mentally twisted and/or fucked, at least it isn't another personality crawling out of the woodwork as with mcfagly.

Yeah, but I wonder what she does when she's not hanging out with us. :zoinks: