INTENSITY²
Politics, Mature and taboo => Political Pundits => Topic started by: Parts on January 08, 2008, 02:06:39 PM
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I have no problem with this but what about the rest of the country. What are your opinions on the subject do you think they can be elected or is the US not ready yet.
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Not this time, thank you.
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Whats the other choice yet another republican term
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Eh, I misread. I oppose the two likely dems.
Yeah, one could be elected. Gonna be
a bit harder than otherwise though.
I wouldn't be surprised if the republicans
hold onto power, on this alone.
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I wouldn't be surprised if the republicans
hold onto power, on this alone.
It's sad but I think it's true also
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To make such changes takes a lot.
Kennedy, was the first Catholic
to win. But, he was a remarkable
candidate (even if an awful president),
running against a particularly questionable
one. PLUS, there had been another attempt.
Still, the war seems damned unpopular here.
Sadly, none of the likely dems are strong voices
against it.
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I don't have a problem with electing either, but Obama has already gotten credible death threats and was given Secret Service protection early in the campaign. Clinton already had Secret Service protection as the wife of a former President. I think that if Obama is elected there is a high probability that he will be assassinated. There are so many white supremacist loons who would be willing to die to kill him that one of them will be likely to succeed. Jesse Jackson also got Secret Service protection early in his campaign because of death threats and I believe this may be part of the reason Colin Powell chose not to run.
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I suspect Powell had something hidden.
Probably some nepotism, given his personality.
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I suspect Powell had something hidden.
Probably some nepotism, given his personality.
Actually, I think that the rest of the story is that his wife has depression and he did not want to expose her to the difficulties of a Presidential campaign.
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I don't trust the man.
Then again, he's human,
so that makes sense.
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I don't trust the man.
Then again, he's human,
so that makes sense.
You don't trust anybody, do you?
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You don't trust anybody, do you?
:laugh:
Pretty much.
I HAVE. Always proven a mistake.
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I hate this "are we ready yet?" bullshit. Uh jeez, I guess the US is too racist to have a black president, so I have to be racist and not vote for him.
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Spoken like a true redneck.
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I don't get why anyone cares whether it's a woman or it's black
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I don't get why anyone cares whether it's a woman or it's black
The US is one of the most socially conservative western countries, so a female or black president would be a cultural landmark and of interest to the rest of the world due to the extent of US influence around the world.
The day the US elects a black lesbian atheist is the day I become interested in moving there. Interestingly, an atheist candidate is at even more of a disadvantage than a homosexual one:
http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/2007/02/black_president_more_likely_than_mormon_or_atheist_/
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I read about the atheist thing
It's pretty fucked up
I can see what it's relevant, but I mean I can't see why it bothers people who are against it.
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I wouldn't mind a black president or a woman but Hilary, I'm not sure about her yet. There is nothing in the constitution about what nationality you have to be or gender. You have to be at least 35 years of age, born in the United State and be a citizen more than 14 years I think. You have to meet all three to run. I'm pretty private about my politics so I don't say much about them and my opinions and beliefs.
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I don't get why anyone cares whether it's a woman or it's black
You know, most of those who do,
probably don't think that they do.
Built in stereotypes. Hillary (and
Nancy Pelosi too) gets called shrill.
Those who support, might call them feisty.
But, neither term is used for males. And, whatever
connotations go with such terms may just seem
WRONG, at the moment of voting. These things
are subtle.
Likewise, I'm sure, with blacks. Everyone has preconceptions,
and these get played upon, in judging the fitness. Sometimes,
this is good (like mine about bible thumpers :laugh:), usually
though, they just serve as proxies for the person.
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I read about the atheist thing
It's pretty fucked up
I can see what it's relevant, but I mean I can't see why it bothers people who are against it.
There is a widespread (and understandable)
belief that atheists can have no morals. This
IS wrong, but it comes cleanly from the
kind of arguments that I make. I could make
a similar argument about Calvinists though. :laugh:
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So basically your country is full of thick religious cunts?
I am intolerant too. I wouldn't vote for a religious nutcase if I had a gun to my head
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would you vote for an atheist nutcase? :toporly:
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would you vote for an atheist nutcase? :toporly:
:laugh: :plus:
There's already a nutcase in the White House so that really isn't much of a stretch.
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would you vote for an atheist nutcase? :toporly:
yes :orly:
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I have no problem with this but what about the rest of the country. What are your opinions on the subject do you think they can be elected or is the US not ready yet.
Opinion polls show Americans only oppose the election of an Atheist president. Right now they are more accepting of voting a Black president than they were of a Catholic President in 1960.
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I have no problem with this but what about the rest of the country. What are your opinions on the subject do you think they can be elected or is the US not ready yet.
Opinion polls show Americans only oppose the election of an Atheist president. Right now they are more accepting of voting a Black president than they were of a Catholic President in 1960.
Lot of people lie in these things as hiding racists views seems to be the American way
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Lot of people lie in these things as hiding racists views seems to be the American way
94% now accepting of a black president and 70% in 1960 of a Catholic one is quite a gap which cannot be easily explained away.
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Lot of people lie in these things as hiding racists views seems to be the American way
94% now accepting of a black president and 70% in 1960 of a Catholic one is quite a gap which cannot be easily explained away.
Maybe they were thinking at least he's not a black Atheist :P
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:lol:
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My guess is that he wouldn't tell, anyway. :laugh:
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Lot of people lie in these things as hiding racists views seems to be the American way
94% now accepting of a black president and 70% in 1960 of a Catholic one is quite a gap which cannot be easily explained away.
Except that toleration is more the ACCEPTABLE way
to be. Might not mean much real change, when faced
with the kinds of hidden bigotry, which I suspect plays
a large role.
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would you vote for an atheist nutcase? :toporly:
:laugh: :plus:
There's already a nutcase in the White House so that really isn't much of a stretch.
:lol:
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Looks like the woman made a comeback.
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Looks like the woman made a comeback.
If she is elected, I hope that she can get the health care initiative to pass the House and Senate. She wants everyone who sells health insurance to the Federal government to sell it to any American who wants to buy it for the same price they offer government employees, with the same lack of exclusion of pre-existing conditions. Right now, employees of the Federal government can choose between maybe hundreds of different health insurance plans, so it would be nice for ordinary people to be able to buy health insurance if they need it.
The only reason we were able to buy health insurance after my husband lost his job was because we bought it under COBRA for the 18 months, then bought the conversion policy, which was crappy insurance and expensive, but at least we had health insurance.
Some plans allow participants and beneficiaries to convert group health coverage to an individual policy. If this option is generally available from the plan, a qualified beneficiary who pays for COBRA coverage must be given the option of converting to an individual policy at the end of the COBRA continuation coverage period. The option must be given to enroll in a conversion health plan within 180 days before COBRA coverage ends. The premium for a conversion policy may be more expensive than the premium of a group plan, and the conversion policy may provide a lower level of coverage. The conversion option, however, is not available if the beneficiary ends COBRA coverage before reaching the end of the maximum period of COBRA coverage.
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I don't get why anyone cares whether it's a woman or it's black
The US is one of the most socially conservative western countries, so a female or black president would be a cultural landmark and of interest to the rest of the world due to the extent of US influence around the world.
The day the US elects a black lesbian atheist is the day I become interested in moving there. Interestingly, an atheist candidate is at even more of a disadvantage than a homosexual one:
http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/2007/02/black_president_more_likely_than_mormon_or_atheist_/
America in a strange country, it has very socially liberal places and very socially conservative places. Mind you in Britain, an Catholic could never get elected Prime Minister (Blair delayed his conversion to catholicism for this reason).
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Looks like the woman made a comeback.
If she is elected, I hope that she can get the health care initiative to pass the House and Senate. She wants everyone who sells health insurance to the Federal government to sell it to any American who wants to buy it for the same price they offer government employees, with the same lack of exclusion of pre-existing conditions. Right now, employees of the Federal government can choose between maybe hundreds of different health insurance plans, so it would be nice for ordinary people to be able to buy health insurance if they need it.
The only reason we were able to buy health insurance after my husband lost his job was because we bought it under COBRA for the 18 months, then bought the conversion policy, which was crappy insurance and expensive, but at least we had health insurance.
Some plans allow participants and beneficiaries to convert group health coverage to an individual policy. If this option is generally available from the plan, a qualified beneficiary who pays for COBRA coverage must be given the option of converting to an individual policy at the end of the COBRA continuation coverage period. The option must be given to enroll in a conversion health plan within 180 days before COBRA coverage ends. The premium for a conversion policy may be more expensive than the premium of a group plan, and the conversion policy may provide a lower level of coverage. The conversion option, however, is not available if the beneficiary ends COBRA coverage before reaching the end of the maximum period of COBRA coverage.
COBRA really sucks too when I was offered it when I left one job the price was unbelievable luckily My new boss at the time got me on the company's plan early so I didn't need it. Now being self employed I am lucky my wife is a teacher and have insurance though her or I would not be able to work for myself.
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I don't get why anyone cares whether it's a woman or it's black
The US is one of the most socially conservative western countries, so a female or black president would be a cultural landmark and of interest to the rest of the world due to the extent of US influence around the world.
The day the US elects a black lesbian atheist is the day I become interested in moving there. Interestingly, an atheist candidate is at even more of a disadvantage than a homosexual one:
http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/2007/02/black_president_more_likely_than_mormon_or_atheist_/
America in a strange country, it has very socially liberal places and very socially conservative places. Mind you in Britain, an Catholic could never get elected Prime Minister (Blair delayed his conversion to catholicism for this reason).
Thats actually bollocks. The electorate in the UK dont give much of a fuck about what faith their politicians are (as long as they dont make a big fuss about it). He was unsure if there was an archaic law still in force which would bar a Catholic from being PM, not whether he could get elected.
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If the U.S. elects a black president, it means that they've grown up as a nation. No more white supremacy bullshit; throw that social darwinist bollocks where it belongs -- in the gutter.
I don't care if some immigrant or coloured person becomes the Prime Minister in my backyard as long as they do a good job at it.
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I don't get why anyone cares whether it's a woman or it's black
You know, most of those who do,
probably don't think that they do.
Built in stereotypes.
Is this meant to encourage racism and sexism? Because that's the effect it has. People who genuinely don't care get accused of caring - on what grounds? "Everyone does it"? How the heck will we eliminate such things from the social system when you can't even say you've moved beyond them without getting accused of denial?
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Woman president should allow everyone to walk around naked
:laugh:
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I don't get why anyone cares whether it's a woman or it's black
You know, most of those who do,
probably don't think that they do.
Built in stereotypes.
Is this meant to encourage racism and sexism? Because that's the effect it has. People who genuinely don't care get accused of caring - on what grounds? "Everyone does it"? How the heck will we eliminate such things from the social system when you can't even say you've moved beyond them without getting accused of denial?
Nah. You're missing the point. Those of us
who believe that we don't should examine
more carefully, that's all. It's clearly better to
have hidden racism, than to string niggers up
from trees. And it's much better to have
hidden sexism, than to blatantly not hire
women, for their gender.
BUT, we have a ways to go. So long as
there are cultural differences, they will
effect such decisions. And, in some cases,
like choosing our leaders, this can be especially
dangerous.
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Looks like the woman made a comeback.
If she is elected, I hope that she can get the health care initiative to pass the House and Senate. She wants everyone who sells health insurance to the Federal government to sell it to any American who wants to buy it for the same price they offer government employees, with the same lack of exclusion of pre-existing conditions. Right now, employees of the Federal government can choose between maybe hundreds of different health insurance plans, so it would be nice for ordinary people to be able to buy health insurance if they need it.
The only reason we were able to buy health insurance after my husband lost his job was because we bought it under COBRA for the 18 months, then bought the conversion policy, which was crappy insurance and expensive, but at least we had health insurance.
Some plans allow participants and beneficiaries to convert group health coverage to an individual policy. If this option is generally available from the plan, a qualified beneficiary who pays for COBRA coverage must be given the option of converting to an individual policy at the end of the COBRA continuation coverage period. The option must be given to enroll in a conversion health plan within 180 days before COBRA coverage ends. The premium for a conversion policy may be more expensive than the premium of a group plan, and the conversion policy may provide a lower level of coverage. The conversion option, however, is not available if the beneficiary ends COBRA coverage before reaching the end of the maximum period of COBRA coverage.
Clinton wont get too much of the Health Care package through, look at Bill's attempts. The one (out of those who support it) who has the best chance is Huccabee.
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Nah. You're missing the point. Those of us
who believe that we don't should examine
more carefully, that's all.
I'm just sick of being told to examine more carefully, that's all. What the heck kind of proof does it take to actually get people to believe I'm not racist or sexist?
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Nah. You're missing the point. Those of us
who believe that we don't should examine
more carefully, that's all.
I'm just sick of being told to examine more carefully, that's all. What the heck kind of proof does it take to actually get people to believe I'm not racist or sexist?
But, I'm not accusing YOU, or any other
single person (except for me). Still, I DO
suspect that there are a hell of a lot of
liberal minded folk, who end up making
judgments for suspicious feelings.
Certainly SEEMS to come across that way,
when words like shrill ONLY apply to females.
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True, I'm being defensive.
However, you did accuse "Those of us who believe that we don't", which includes me and also the subset of the population who legitimately aren't racist and know it.
I don't deny that there is still racism and sexism in North American culture, and that it can be demonstrated by words like "shrill". I'm making the point that those people who aren't racist can have a very hard time getting people to believe them, and that adds to the general fear and segregation. Getting repeatedly accused of something you're not guilty of can create hostility over the issue which otherwise wouldn't have existed.
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Looks like the woman made a comeback.
If she is elected, I hope that she can get the health care initiative to pass the House and Senate. She wants everyone who sells health insurance to the Federal government to sell it to any American who wants to buy it for the same price they offer government employees, with the same lack of exclusion of pre-existing conditions. Right now, employees of the Federal government can choose between maybe hundreds of different health insurance plans, so it would be nice for ordinary people to be able to buy health insurance if they need it.
The only reason we were able to buy health insurance after my husband lost his job was because we bought it under COBRA for the 18 months, then bought the conversion policy, which was crappy insurance and expensive, but at least we had health insurance.
Some plans allow participants and beneficiaries to convert group health coverage to an individual policy. If this option is generally available from the plan, a qualified beneficiary who pays for COBRA coverage must be given the option of converting to an individual policy at the end of the COBRA continuation coverage period. The option must be given to enroll in a conversion health plan within 180 days before COBRA coverage ends. The premium for a conversion policy may be more expensive than the premium of a group plan, and the conversion policy may provide a lower level of coverage. The conversion option, however, is not available if the beneficiary ends COBRA coverage before reaching the end of the maximum period of COBRA coverage.
Clinton wont get too much of the Health Care package through, look at Bill's attempts. The one (out of those who support it) who has the best chance is Huccabee.
I think it was Hillary who tried to pass those reforms during the 90s, actually.
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Nah. You're missing the point. Those of us
who believe that we don't should examine
more carefully, that's all.
I'm just sick of being told to examine more carefully, that's all. What the heck kind of proof does it take to actually get people to believe I'm not racist or sexist?
The real question is why do you care whichever way people think on the matter. Surely if you know that you are neither racist nor sexist then that would be enough?
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True, I'm being defensive.
However, you did accuse "Those of us who believe that we don't", which includes me and also the subset of the population who legitimately aren't racist and know it.
I don't deny that there is still racism and sexism in North American culture, and that it can be demonstrated by words like "shrill". I'm making the point that those people who aren't racist can have a very hard time getting people to believe them, and that adds to the general fear and segregation. Getting repeatedly accused of something you're not guilty of can create hostility over the issue which otherwise wouldn't have existed.
Fair enough. I was probably projecting.
I KNOW that I have some little attitudes
of such (mostly learned later in life). And
probably just think that I'm oh so great for
recognizing what I think is in all of us.
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I think it was Hillary who tried to pass those reforms during the 90s, actually.
She lead the design. I think that the whole thing was done
to protect the president. And to give her a boost, should it
work, and she seek office. But yeah.
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Looks like the woman made a comeback.
If she is elected, I hope that she can get the health care initiative to pass the House and Senate. She wants everyone who sells health insurance to the Federal government to sell it to any American who wants to buy it for the same price they offer government employees, with the same lack of exclusion of pre-existing conditions. Right now, employees of the Federal government can choose between maybe hundreds of different health insurance plans, so it would be nice for ordinary people to be able to buy health insurance if they need it.
The only reason we were able to buy health insurance after my husband lost his job was because we bought it under COBRA for the 18 months, then bought the conversion policy, which was crappy insurance and expensive, but at least we had health insurance.
Some plans allow participants and beneficiaries to convert group health coverage to an individual policy. If this option is generally available from the plan, a qualified beneficiary who pays for COBRA coverage must be given the option of converting to an individual policy at the end of the COBRA continuation coverage period. The option must be given to enroll in a conversion health plan within 180 days before COBRA coverage ends. The premium for a conversion policy may be more expensive than the premium of a group plan, and the conversion policy may provide a lower level of coverage. The conversion option, however, is not available if the beneficiary ends COBRA coverage before reaching the end of the maximum period of COBRA coverage.
Clinton wont get too much of the Health Care package through, look at Bill's attempts. The one (out of those who support it) who has the best chance is Huccabee.
I think it was Hillary who tried to pass those reforms during the 90s, actually.
And failed. A republican trying to get something like this through has a better chance.
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And failed. A republican trying to get something like this through has a better chance.
No way. 20 years ago, but not now.
His party would eviscerate him.
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Looks like the woman made a comeback.
If she is elected, I hope that she can get the health care initiative to pass the House and Senate. She wants everyone who sells health insurance to the Federal government to sell it to any American who wants to buy it for the same price they offer government employees, with the same lack of exclusion of pre-existing conditions. Right now, employees of the Federal government can choose between maybe hundreds of different health insurance plans, so it would be nice for ordinary people to be able to buy health insurance if they need it.
The only reason we were able to buy health insurance after my husband lost his job was because we bought it under COBRA for the 18 months, then bought the conversion policy, which was crappy insurance and expensive, but at least we had health insurance.
Some plans allow participants and beneficiaries to convert group health coverage to an individual policy. If this option is generally available from the plan, a qualified beneficiary who pays for COBRA coverage must be given the option of converting to an individual policy at the end of the COBRA continuation coverage period. The option must be given to enroll in a conversion health plan within 180 days before COBRA coverage ends. The premium for a conversion policy may be more expensive than the premium of a group plan, and the conversion policy may provide a lower level of coverage. The conversion option, however, is not available if the beneficiary ends COBRA coverage before reaching the end of the maximum period of COBRA coverage.
Clinton wont get too much of the Health Care package through, look at Bill's attempts. The one (out of those who support it) who has the best chance is Huccabee.
I think it was Hillary who tried to pass those reforms during the 90s, actually.
Yes, she did. She also got some legislation passed concerning health care, which was the only reason we could even get the conversion policy after our COBRA ran out.
And failed. A republican trying to get something like this through has a better chance.
No way. 20 years ago, but not now.
His party would eviscerate him.
:agreed:
Huckabee did say this, though:
"You know, if you want to know how to fix it, I've got a solution. Either give every American the same kind of health care that Congress has, or make Congress have the same kind of health care that every American has. They'll get it fixed. We really have an incredible problem because our system is upside-down. It focuses on intervention at the catastrophic level of disease rather than really focusing on prevention. So we've got a system that, no matter how much money we pour into it, we're not going to fix it, until we begin to address the fact that this country has put its focus not on wellness, not on health, but on sickness."
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It's a good point, but the problem is,
this is what HMO's were supposed to
be. Somehow, instead of being that,
they became merely a cheaper way
to deliver the old style of service. Kinda
like walmart. :-\
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I'm thankful we don't have a health care system like yours.
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What health care system? :laugh:
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The real question is why do you care whichever way people think on the matter. Surely if you know that you are neither racist nor sexist then that would be enough?
LOL, because I'm a human being? And because I see a system where racism persists far beyond what it ought to, despite the presence of affirmative action, political correctness, and all the other social policies designed to eliminate it. So I'm looking for reasons society as a whole can't just get the hell over the issue and move on with their lives.
And one of the reasons I see is that there is actually negative pressure against individuals who have already resolved the issue for themselves. I'm not the only white person I know who is wary of saying this that or the other thing in case it might be misconstrued as racist. And I know how many guys there are who walk on tiptoes about making jokes about women when there's a female within earshot, lest they bring the rabid feminists down on their heads, while women make the same jokes about men with alacrity.
So I think, at least among more liberal people, that there ought to be a more of a trend towards bluntness, instead of all the pussyfooting.
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So I think, at least among more liberal people, that there ought to be a more of a trend towards bluntness, instead of all the pussyfooting.
:agreed:
THIS is a part of it, really.
Makes it harder to hide, if
you're speaking what you really
feel.
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Thats actually bollocks. The electorate in the UK dont give much of a fuck about what faith their politicians are (as long as they dont make a big fuss about it). He was unsure if there was an archaic law still in force which would bar a Catholic from being PM, not whether he could get elected.
Thanks for correcting me on this. I was unsure on the level of anti-catholic feeling still remaining in British society.
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Sometimes, I wonder if there's actually
more in the US. Given the way fundies
seem to consider the RCC.
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The real question is why do you care whichever way people think on the matter. Surely if you know that you are neither racist nor sexist then that would be enough?
LOL, because I'm a human being? And because I see a system where racism persists far beyond what it ought to, despite the presence of affirmative action, political correctness, and all the other social policies designed to eliminate it. So I'm looking for reasons society as a whole can't just get the hell over the issue and move on with their lives.
And one of the reasons I see is that there is actually negative pressure against individuals who have already resolved the issue for themselves. I'm not the only white person I know who is wary of saying this that or the other thing in case it might be misconstrued as racist. And I know how many guys there are who walk on tiptoes about making jokes about women when there's a female within earshot, lest they bring the rabid feminists down on their heads, while women make the same jokes about men with alacrity.
So I think, at least among more liberal people, that there ought to be a more of a trend towards bluntness, instead of all the pussyfooting.
Of course there is negative pressure against those who cannot resolve it themselves, typically from those who are insecure about their own stance on the matter. As for tiptoes, I truly couldn't give a fuck, by keeping a high enough profile I will meet enough people who like me regardless. People do not have a right not to be offended, one quality people should all have is the ability to laugh at themselves. Taking my line on it is a convenient filter for those who I don't particularly want to associate with.
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Thats actually bollocks. The electorate in the UK dont give much of a fuck about what faith their politicians are (as long as they dont make a big fuss about it). He was unsure if there was an archaic law still in force which would bar a Catholic from being PM, not whether he could get elected.
Thanks for correcting me on this. I was unsure on the level of anti-catholic feeling still remaining in British society.
no bother. there are a hell of a lot of catholics in the UK thanks in part to mass immigration from Ireland in the past as well as Poles, Italians, etc. The recent wave of Polish migrants has boosted the number of regular churchgoers in the Cathoilc church so there are more Catholic than Anglican bums on seats most sundays. the only places there's bad feeling are Ulster and parts of Scotland. More people are interested in Big Brother than any particular brand of faith. :-\
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There was a lot of Cathloics in the UK after I've been through with them! Ahahahaha... AHAHAHAHAAA!!!
:tooledup:
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A lot of my ancestors were catholic immigrants
Little Ireland i just down the road from my university
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I don't get why anyone cares whether it's a woman or it's black
i don't really, i just want Dennis to win.
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Looks like the woman made a comeback.
If she is elected, I hope that she can get the health care initiative to pass the House and Senate. She wants everyone who sells health insurance to the Federal government to sell it to any American who wants to buy it for the same price they offer government employees, with the same lack of exclusion of pre-existing conditions. Right now, employees of the Federal government can choose between maybe hundreds of different health insurance plans, so it would be nice for ordinary people to be able to buy health insurance if they need it.
The only reason we were able to buy health insurance after my husband lost his job was because we bought it under COBRA for the 18 months, then bought the conversion policy, which was crappy insurance and expensive, but at least we had health insurance.
Some plans allow participants and beneficiaries to convert group health coverage to an individual policy. If this option is generally available from the plan, a qualified beneficiary who pays for COBRA coverage must be given the option of converting to an individual policy at the end of the COBRA continuation coverage period. The option must be given to enroll in a conversion health plan within 180 days before COBRA coverage ends. The premium for a conversion policy may be more expensive than the premium of a group plan, and the conversion policy may provide a lower level of coverage. The conversion option, however, is not available if the beneficiary ends COBRA coverage before reaching the end of the maximum period of COBRA coverage.
is that related to the Cobra Event? :P
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Nah. You're missing the point. Those of us
who believe that we don't should examine
more carefully, that's all.
I'm just sick of being told to examine more carefully, that's all. What the heck kind of proof does it take to actually get people to believe I'm not racist or sexist?
But, I'm not accusing YOU, or any other
single person (except for me). Still, I DO
suspect that there are a hell of a lot of
liberal minded folk, who end up making
judgments for suspicious feelings.
i'm way liberal but i see myself making judgements. that's because i'm hyperaware of myself. i analyze everything i do. it's a pain in the ass. anyway, i am really liberal and still catch myself sometimes thinking or reacting in ways that are not how i want to react... because of social conditioning or something. that's just how it goes. as long as i am aware of that and let it not affect how i treat people, that's most important. i can continue to work on them at my own pace.
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i'm way liberal but i see myself making judgements. that's because i'm hyperaware of myself. i analyze everything i do. it's a pain in the ass. anyway, i am really liberal and still catch myself sometimes thinking or reacting in ways that are not how i want to react... because of social conditioning or something. that's just how it goes. as long as i am aware of that and let it not affect how i treat people, that's most important. i can continue to work on them at my own pace.
Exactly. But, I guess I just presume
that everyone has biases. Can't imagine
them not, actually.
But, I have to trust Py, when she claims
not to. Even if all my evidence from others
points differently. I don't know her. Maybe
she's pure.
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yes. never know. :laugh:
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But, I have to trust Py, when she claims
not to. Even if all my evidence from others
points differently. I don't know her. Maybe
she's pure.
I'm not saying I don't have biases, I'm saying I don't have those particular biases. I don't care what gender you are. I don't care what color your skin is. Though I'm starting to see that in this society I ought to expect people with darker skin to have a chip on their shoulders about race.
A few of the things I am biased about:
- philosophy
- mental health (I don't like depressives)
- work (I look down on people who don't try to work or find work)
- risk tolerance (I really have a problem with people who try to enforce their safety standards on others)
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A few of the things I am biased about:
- philosophy
- mental health (I don't like depressives)
- work (I look down on people who don't try to work or find work)
- risk tolerance (I really have a problem with people who try to enforce their safety standards on others)
Hmm...given that you don't like my philosophy,
I'm seeing that every single one of those
strikes me. :laugh:
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:laugh: I know. I find those I hate fascinating. This is my way of questioning my biases.
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To know me is to love me though.
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Meaning I won't love you till I know you, or I won't know you till I love you?
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Take it in the biblical sense.
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hIllary doesn't count as a woman.
oBama is just as bad as hIllary in terms of policy, it's just that he isn't one crazy assed fucked up bitch
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Cow Kitty would be THE BEST president EVER!
She would effectively veto EVERY law, returning the country to the time when it didn't suck.
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But, I have to trust Py, when she claims
not to. Even if all my evidence from others
points differently. I don't know her. Maybe
she's pure.
I'm not saying I don't have biases, I'm saying I don't have those particular biases. I don't care what gender you are. I don't care what color your skin is. Though I'm starting to see that in this society I ought to expect people with darker skin to have a chip on their shoulders about race.
A few of the things I am biased about:
- mental health (I don't like depressives)
- work (I look down on people who don't try to work or find work)
I'm going to allow this post to apply to me personally, because I'm currently bored and could do with an argument to pass the time.
People like yourself, HG and JMan make me laugh. You lot have had major issues in your past lives, and for you guys to put down on the gutless and hopeless spastics like me and Dunc is laughable in itself. Some of us do have the right to find a job that suits our needs. I don't see you three applying for driving, postal or cleaning jobs (mainly computer work or psychology jobs, oh my!), so who the fuck are you to tell ME that I'm not trying or that I'm too picky? You think I was born here so that you cockroaches can feel good about yourselves by putting us all down with your condescending bullshit?
And do you know what it's like in the UK for disabled folk of any kind, that they're not offered equal opportunities because our society is quick to impose limitations on us because we're disabled? Do you think it's wise to put an agoraphobic in a supermarket job where he/she may have a mental breakdown with all those people? What practical help are you providing for these people, personally? Oh, I forget: it's too convenient to judge the unemployed and the mentally fucked-up than it is to use your skills and abilities to help them be financially independent.
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I'm going to allow this post to apply to me personally, because I'm currently bored and could do with an argument to pass the time.
Okay, I'll take you on. Nothing personal - I like a good fight too.
People like yourself, HG and JMan make me laugh. You lot have had major issues in your past lives, and for you guys to put down on the gutless and hopeless spastics like me and Dunc is laughable in itself. Some of us do have the right to find a job that suits our needs.
One, you're neither gutless nor hopeless; two, I have never claimed you don't have the right to find a job that suits your needs. You can do whatever you damn well please - and yet it pushes your buttons to hear me say I think you should try harder. So I suspect that on some level you agree with me, or you really wouldn't care what I think. You may not have seen evidence of me trying for basic jobs - well, I haven't seen evidence of you trying to work despite your issues. Now I don't know you in real life, so I may just be missing it. And I'm open to being wrong. But I haven't seen it.
I don't see you three applying for driving, postal or cleaning jobs (mainly computer work or psychology jobs, oh my!), so who the fuck are you to tell ME that I'm not trying or that I'm too picky?
Check your facts before you make accusations. I've applied for entry-level positions at Walmart, Meijers, Home Depot (major USA chain stores) as well as waitressing jobs. At Steak and Shake they laughed me out of the place, because my resume had stuff like "Art Director" and "Graphic Designer and Illustrator". They asked whether I was making a career change into hospitality.... I just needed the money. I can't know for certain but my guess is that I looked so overqualified that they assumed I must have something else seriously wrong with me. They were kinda right. :P
And do you know what it's like in the UK for disabled folk of any kind, that they're not offered equal opportunities because our society is quick to impose limitations on us because we're disabled?
Nope, but I seriously doubt the USA is any better.
Do you think it's wise to put an agoraphobic in a supermarket job where he/she may have a mental breakdown with all those people?
Here's where I get lambasted, but yes. Why? Sink or swim. People are more resourceful than they think, and the fact of this earth is that if you have a disability, you're going to have to scramble harder in order to hold your own. I know there comes a point where people are not physically capable of pushing themselves any farther, and that's fine - that's the time to stop and adjust to one's limitations. But can you honestly tell me you've reached that point?
What practical help are you providing for these people, personally? Oh, I forget: it's too convenient to judge the unemployed and the mentally fucked-up than it is to use your skills and abilities to help them be financially independent.
I judge no one any harsher than I judge myself. The practical help I am providing personally is mostly going to my partner and close friends, because I haven't yet mastered the art of helping large groups of people at once. But don't you worry - I don't say things like this out of convenience or laziness, I say them because I believe them, and I do live out my values in real life.
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I can't get a job now because the only job I'd be able to get at my age and with no degree yet (afaik) is in a shop etc, working with customers. I can't do that now because of social anxiety and disorientation problems and stuff. I get no help with these things for free (as I am over 18 and, apart from student services, the only autistic-related help they give is for under-18s). So I am paying to see a support worker. I'll be paying for iot myself, and it will be costing me over half the money I have per month.
If I was to just force myself to get a job in a shop now, I wouldn't last five minutes. I'm still trying to sort myself out for depression (drugs not been working), and adding a job to that would end in some kind of nervous breakdown or something. I don't want to be in that position. My mum has two other kids to look after, and it's my step-dad who pays all the bills etc, so it's not like I don't feel bad about these things. But it's also not as simple as just going out and getting a job.
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No. It's not so simple. Indeed, I DID try and push
myself (had to) and got such jobs. On the phone.
I'm lucky I wasn't arrested.
But, there are other kinds of low end
jobs for unskilled. Such as stock work.
Or cleaning.
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I couldn't be a cleaner because of ocd, I'm not bothered about doing boring shitty work though, or for a long time or whatever. But where I live the only places I could work would be with people.
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I'm going to allow this post to apply to me personally, because I'm currently bored and could do with an argument to pass the time.
Okay, I'll take you on. Nothing personal - I like a good fight too.
Rawr. I came prepared myself. Unlike my recent half-assed one liners, I've written a draft in response to this argument on a notepad.
Fuck off. :P
One, you're neither gutless nor hopeless; two, I have never claimed you don't have the right to find a job that suits your needs. You can do whatever you damn well please - and yet it pushes your buttons to hear me say I think you should try harder. So I suspect that on some level you agree with me, or you really wouldn't care what I think. You may not have seen evidence of me trying for basic jobs - well, I haven't seen evidence of you trying to work despite your issues. Now I don't know you in real life, so I may just be missing it. And I'm open to being wrong. But I haven't seen it.
Yes, you've pushed my buttons; if you didn't then I wouldn't respond to you.
Though it isn't hard to rile me up over this considering that it's a sensitive issue for me. Oh woe is me for not being the hunting and gathering male. :violin:
Check your facts before you make accusations. I've applied for entry-level positions at Walmart, Meijers, Home Depot (major USA chain stores) as well as waitressing jobs. At Steak and Shake they laughed me out of the place, because my resume had stuff like "Art Director" and "Graphic Designer and Illustrator". They asked whether I was making a career change into hospitality.... I just needed the money. I can't know for certain but my guess is that I looked so overqualified that they assumed I must have something else seriously wrong with me. They were kinda right. :P
Hey, if you have chosen to get involved in my life and my personal (lol!) business, back it up with personal experiences and how emotionally daunting it was for you to cope in those jobs. Otherwise, I'm going to assume that you're a close-minded, stuck-up, social-darwinistic bitch who doesn't know what she's on about. :P
You know full well that I've been trying to get on the ladder of unemployment through my voluntary work for the past couple of years. I was trying to build up good job references and to also improve my people's skills, which is pretty admirable for someone who is a self-diagnosed agoraphobic. It's not putting meat on the table, sure, but it's a start -- and it's for a good cause.
Nope, but I seriously doubt the USA is any better.
Fact: The USA has more job opportunities than the UK does.
Also, the USA have a more positive attitude towards the disabled, which is quite ironic considering that they still use outdated autism research.
There was this tv documentary about a Tourette's sufferer who wasn't getting any equal opportunities in the UK, since he was patronised and regarded as a thicko. When he moved into the United States, however, he acquired a good job AND a girlfriend in tow.
Here's where I get lambasted, but yes. Why? Sink or swim. People are more resourceful than they think, and the fact of this earth is that if you have a disability, you're going to have to scramble harder in order to hold your own. I know there comes a point where people are not physically capable of pushing themselves any farther, and that's fine - that's the time to stop and adjust to one's limitations. But can you honestly tell me you've reached that point?
Where did I say that I've reached my limit? I'm still applying for jobs: one is for a retailing job at a video games shop (full-time); the other is a part-time one at a garden superstore -- as I have some gardening experience. I won't know when I'll get these jobs until I get an interview, which may take up to one, two... maybe three weeks time. :p
I've also registered myself with other cleaning agencies, but there's no local work right now because it's Janurary, and Janurary is always a funny time of the year when it comes to jobs.
I judge no one any harsher than I judge myself. The practical help I am providing personally is mostly going to my partner and close friends, because I haven't yet mastered the art of helping large groups of people at once. But don't you worry - I don't say things like this out of convenience or laziness, I say them because I believe them, and I do live out my values in real life.
That's fine, but I don't have the habit of chastising people online over work just because I don't have a close relationship with them. People who just post this shit and fucks off afterwards piss me off a little. I could easily disregard it as text on a screen but I'm dealing with actual human beings here.
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Hey, if you have chosen to get involved in my life and my personal (lol!) business, back it up with personal experiences and how emotionally daunting it was for you to cope in those jobs.
Your wish is my command. :angel:
Though I don't particularly want to get into a "my angst is worse than your angst!" contest. And I'm always worried that's how it sounds when I talk about stuff.
I'm not agoraphobic, but I'm likely social-phobic - that's what they said was wrong with me before they figured out about autism. I got lucky - my father started throwing me into social challenges when I was in my early teens, so by the time I started working, I had practice at facing fear. He would volunteer me to do software presentations at the local computer users' group, without asking first, and I'd do them because I was more scared of him than them. He set me up doing game reviews, which required I make business calls to game companies from the pay phone at school. I remember one time I was pale and shaking enough afterwards that the girls at the lunch table thought I was sick.
I've fucked up too. I chickened out of one of the software presentations once and had to ask him to do it for me. I've lost the ability to talk in job interviews and presentations. Last fall I did caricatures at a flea market and a guy liked my work enough that he invited me to work at his company's events. But after a couple weeks of stress and two days of sitting with the phone in my hand and wanting to scream, I stopped being able to call him back and lost the opportunity. I have a baseline level of fear when I'm around other people, so I tend to appear stiff and formal from keeping it under control. A career advisor once told me she wouldn't hire me because of it, because she couldn't get a sense of my personality. I find it very hard to fake being cool and relaxed, and that seems to be what people want from a job candidate.
Otherwise, I'm going to assume that you're a close-minded, stuck-up, social-darwinistic bitch who doesn't know what she's on about. :P
Guilty as charged - on the stuck-up and social-darwinistic, anyway. The others you'll have to judge for yourself.
You know full well that I've been trying to get on the ladder of unemployment through my voluntary work for the past couple of years. I was trying to build up good job references and to also improve my people's skills, which is pretty admirable for someone who is a self-diagnosed agoraphobic. It's not putting meat on the table, sure, but it's a start -- and it's for a good cause.
Completely agreed. The reason I thought you weren't trying hard is because the last couple times you've come on here talking about an opportunity, you've built up anticipation for days - and then quit after the first day. It looks defeatist. Is it agoraphobia that's stopping you? How do you fight it?
Fact: The USA has more job opportunities than the UK does.
In 2006, the USA unemployment rate was 5.0% and the UK unemployment rate was lower: 4.0%. (http://www.econstats.com/weo/V029.htm) I don't know where you're getting your statistics on number of job opportunities - that can be hard to collect anyway since so many jobs are advertized by word of mouth and never officially recorded. Do you mean more job opportunities total, or more per capita? - because the USA has a much larger population.
Where did I say that I've reached my limit?
Nowhere, but I assumed you had reached a limit for each opportunity, when you left it.
I'm still applying for jobs: one is for a retailing job at a video games shop (full-time); the other is a part-time one at a garden superstore -- as I have some gardening experience. I won't know when I'll get these jobs until I get an interview, which may take up to one, two... maybe three weeks time. :p
I've also registered myself with other cleaning agencies, but there's no local work right now because it's Janurary, and Janurary is always a funny time of the year when it comes to jobs.
More power to you, then. I didn't know how hard you were still looking. You may want to send out more applications yet though. I've been told that several per working day is a good goal, though I can generally only manage one or two.
That's fine, but I don't have the habit of chastising people online over work just because I don't have a close relationship with them.
LOL. If you don't want to know what people think, don't ask them (http://www.intensitysquared.com/index.php?topic=6965.0). I'm more likely to chastize people I do have some kind of relationship with. The others I either don't care or don't know them well enough to judge. Are you pissed off that I gave you honesty instead of a pretty and encouraging white lie?
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Condi Rice for President
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:puke:
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LOL. If you don't want to know what people think, don't ask them. I'm more likely to chastize people I do have some kind of relationship with. The others I either don't care or don't know them well enough to judge. Are you pissed off that I gave you honesty instead of a pretty and encouraging white lie?
Not knocking you for your honesty, nor do I completely disagree with what you have to say. I do respect you and have been always concerned as to how you're doing and shit, even if it's all behind a fucking keyboard and an internet connection. However, I'm human, so I'm going to have moments where I'm going to whine and bitch at people's opinions, even if they are true. I'm not going to keep my cool just so that I can earn more friendship points from the people I have a relationship with. I take people for what they are -- blatant flaws and all. Otherwise, where's the interest, the fun in relationships?
I'll answer the rest of your post later, Py. Sorry, but I'm a bit lethargic at the mo. :yawn:
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Well, don't let me get you down. :)
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Well, don't let me get you down. :)
You're not, so don't worry. Though you would have a chance 5 years ago. :P