INTENSITY²
Politics, Mature and taboo => Political Pundits => Topic started by: Teejay on October 08, 2006, 02:44:49 AM
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I am a great believer in capital punishment (although with caning or flogging for various offenses like they have in Singapore). I believe crimes like murder and treason should be capital offenses and appeals be restricted as much as possible.
Some would say my views are cruel, but personally I do not care, I strongly believe in true equal justice instead of mercy. We need to restore faith in the law enforcement and judical system and being extremely tough on criminals, putting lots of police on the streets is the only possible way to do that.
Believe me very few innocent people, if any are executed even now, well outside dicatorships like Iran and China.
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Believe me very few innocent people, if any are executed even now, well outside dicatorships like Iran and China.
Do you actually have anything to support this statement or do you just believe it to be true?
Some interesting reading for you if you honestly believe that statement:
http://www.quixote.org/ej/grip/reasonabledoubt/index.html (http://www.quixote.org/ej/grip/reasonabledoubt/index.html)
Another interesting fact for you- By 1999, out of 23 people given the death penalty in Illinois since it was reintroduced in 1977 10 people were later released. That's almost half!
http://www.greenleft.org.au/back/1999/350/350p16.htm (http://www.greenleft.org.au/back/1999/350/350p16.htm)
The fact is people have lost faith in the justice system because it has proven to be corrupt time and time again. With witness statements and confessions being coerced out of people, evidence being surpressed, poor legal representation for the defendent, etc, etc. Until the justice system is sorted out I don't know how anyone with good conscience could support the death penelty.
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What about people who are executed that turn out to be innocent? :-|
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What about people who are executed that turn out to be innocent? :-|
Exactly- although I was simply trying to illustrate to Teejay,who believes that very few innocent people are executed, that simply being given the death penalty doesn't actually mean you are guilty, since he believes that appeals should be restricted for those convicted.
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True, and though being on death row would be scary, I think it would be preferable to a lifetime in prison in a way.
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wanna know what i think is funny?
the right to lifers (ie: anti-abortionists) are always the ones on the opposite side of the capitol punishment fence.
they always say, "an eye for an eye."
that's all.
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wanna know what i think is funny?
the right to lifers (ie: anti-abortionists) are always the ones on the opposite side of the capitol punishment fence.
they always say, "an eye for an eye."
that's all.
I do not see opposing abortion and supporting capital punishment as hypocritical, they can claim what did the fetuses do to get aborted apart from their mothers not wanting them, while murders being executed did kill people. IMO, I am not fond of abortion and very much for capital punishment of murders and tratiors (I do not see the point of executing people for other crimes).
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wanna know what i think is funny?
the right to lifers (ie: anti-abortionists) are always the ones on the opposite side of the capitol punishment fence.
they always say, "an eye for an eye."
that's all.
I do not see opposing abortion and supporting capital punishment as hypocritical, they can claim what did the fetuses do to get aborted apart from their mothers not wanting them, while murders being executed did kill people. IMO, I am not fond of abortion and very much for capital punishment of murders and tratiors (I do not see the point of executing people for other crimes).
except they call themselves right to lifers.
and the bible (their guidbook) clearly states that though shall not judge. judgement is reserved for God.
Now, they also believing in saving as many people as possible from the damnations of hell. because a human being judges another worthy of death and follows through with it, then the person having been put to death has little time to make right with god.
simply put, jesus walked with the lepers, tax collectors and prostitutes.
his example is that no-one was beneath saving. why do religious fundamentalists draw a moral line in the sand and say that this type person does not deserve life.
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Teejay- did you not think the question I asked you about your stance was worth answering then??
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I'm for capital punishment, but our courts need to take some more serious measures to make sure they have the right culprit. There are quite a number of death row inmates who were later released. When it's someone poor or has committed other crimes before, no one makes an effort to do a thorough investigation. If this were to change then murderers would not be sitting on death row for decades. If an investigation has been properly performed, and the murderer is guilty beyond a shadow of a doubt, the person needs to be put to death right then and there. Additional money does not need to be spent on an electric chair and death by lethal injection. The person is dead either way, and it would be a hell of lot cheaper to shoot them. And then we wouldn't postpone executions for someone like the piece of work in this article. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Morales
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Teejay- did you not think the question I asked you about your stance was worth answering then??
As I said earlier even if appeals were curtailed, the number of wrongful accused people would be very little. I just have a cheaper attuite to human life than lot of others I guess. I will admit that.
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Teejay- did you not think the question I asked you about your stance was worth answering then??
As I said earlier even if appeals were curtailed, the number of wrongful accused people would be very little. I just have a cheaper attuite to human life than lot of others I guess. I will admit that.
Do you think that almost 50% (as was the case in the Illinois figures I quoted) of people being wrongfully convicted could be any stretch of the imagination be classed as a 'very little' amount?
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i think the most significant flaw in capital punishment is that many people who commit serious crimes are suicidal anyway; one only has to look at the recent massacres in america to see evidence of this. Ian Huntley (british serial sex offender and convicted child-killer) has also been in the news a lot recently for attempting to commit suicide.
if someone committed a serious crime against me, or someone i cared about, i would rather that person was forced to spend the rest of their life in prison (at least until they were physically incapable of posing a threat to society) than for them to be executed and not have to face the consequences of their actions.
plus, another good reason for keeping these people alive is so that psychologists can study them and work on identifying those who are prone to criminal behaviour and try to prevent them from developing in to offenders.
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Why are you posting here, Omega? I thought you wanted to see Intensity² shut down?
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although there are many things that i think are at fault on Intensity, there are few things that i like too.
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although there are many things that i think are at fault on Intensity, there are few things that i like too.
me?
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LOL. :hug:
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LOL. :hug:
what are the others?
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the fact that i don't have to worry too much about having disciplinary action being taken against me if i say the wrong thing, and that there is a high ratio of intelligent people here.
there are probably lots of other things but those are the only ones that i can think of at the moment.
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btw- your new avi, makes me feel strange, down there.
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:LOL: A girl in a black corset hanging bound and suspended in front of a bloodstained concrete wall? I never thought you had it in you, McJ!
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:LOL: A girl in a black corset hanging bound and suspended in front of a bloodstained concrete wall? I never thought you had it in you, McJ!
i thought that was just graffiti.
are you sure it's blood?
could be that time of month....
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(http://img243.imageshack.us/img243/1310/xwannaplayx9ct000tl3.jpg) (http://imageshack.us)
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so it is graffiti. there are other writings on the wall....
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Oooh, and an upside-down ankh. Sigh - I'm probably the only one who finds it amusing that a woman calling herself Anti-Heather and crusading against the cruelty of Intensity would have an avatar that represents death and corruption.
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Oooh, and an upside-down ankh. Sigh - I'm probably the only one who finds it amusing that a woman calling herself Anti-Heather and crusading against the cruelty of Intensity would have an avatar that represents death and corruption.
No you're not. :LMAO:
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Teejay- did you not think the question I asked you about your stance was worth answering then??
As I said earlier even if appeals were curtailed, the number of wrongful accused people would be very little. I just have a cheaper attuite to human life than lot of others I guess. I will admit that.
So let's just hope that you aren't wrongfully accused of killing somebody, then. :P
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(http://img243.imageshack.us/img243/1310/xwannaplayx9ct000tl3.jpg) (http://imageshack.us)
i have that outfit. well, i have several bits which would go together to make a very, very similar outfit to that - dark blue corset/tutu dress and those purple and black striped stockings.
shame one can't see her boots.
of course, i wouldn't look all emo/goth/teenage angst wearing it, though.
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Oooh, and an upside-down ankh. Sigh - I'm probably the only one who finds it amusing that a woman calling herself Anti-Heather and crusading against the cruelty of Intensity would have an avatar that represents death and corruption.
oh, for christ's sake; there are dozens of ways that image could be interpreted but, please, continue to see things exactly the way you want to see them. ::)
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Oooh, and an upside-down ankh. Sigh - I'm probably the only one who finds it amusing that a woman calling herself Anti-Heather and crusading against the cruelty of Intensity would have an avatar that represents death and corruption.
oh, for christ's sake; there are dozens of ways that image could be interpreted but, please, continue to see things exactly the way you want to see them. ::)
Auntie Heather is not amused. :green:
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Auntie Heather is not amused. :green:
stop taking your grudge out on me!
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Bite me, fuckface. :wanker:
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cat fight.
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oh, for christ's sake; there are dozens of ways that image could be interpreted but, please, continue to see things exactly the way you want to see them. ::)
Sure, but no others came to mind that would fit this context quite so well.
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i reckon it's jealousy about my purple and black striped socks, myself.
can't blame anyone for that, obviously: who wouldn't be jealous, eh?
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I wouldn't. :green:
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i love it when you're pervy. :whip: :-*
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oh, for christ's sake; there are dozens of ways that image could be interpreted but, please, continue to see things exactly the way you want to see them. ::)
Sure, but no others came to mind that would fit this context quite so well.
fine, but that reveals far more about the limitations of your "mind" than it does about my choice of avatar.
Bite me, fuckface. :wanker:
no thanks; knowing your propensity to hold grudges, you would probably taste extremely bitter!
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Meow! :ner:
I'd have thought you'd be an expert on bitterness by now, Auntie.
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Do you really think capital punishment is the best punishment? I think:
1. It's not a real punishment for a really grose crime. The anxiety before the execution is performed is the real punishment. I would rather be executed than locked up in jail, beaten and raped by other inmates for decades...
2. It's irreversible. Some people convicted are really innocent.
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maybe they should recreate the anxiety before execution on a weekly basis, without following through with the execution.
sometimes, just for kicks, they should actually hook up all the electrical devices and have it operated by a car battery or something.
make the death row inmate think, you never know!
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Do you really think capital punishment is the best punishment? I think:
1. It's not a real punishment for a really grose crime. The anxiety before the execution is performed is the real punishment. I would rather be executed than locked up in jail, beaten and raped by other inmates for decades...
2. It's irreversible. Some people convicted are really innocent.
I agree with your second reason, Litigious. I know that there were lots of innocent people who were convicted and their convictions were later overturned because of The Innocence Project, which re-investigates old convictions with modern techniques such as DNA analysis. Even DNA analysis, as conclusive as it may seem, could lead to some wrongful convictions because it could be planted on a crime scene or there could be a laboratory error.
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Do you really think capital punishment is the best punishment? I think:
1. It's not a real punishment for a really grose crime. The anxiety before the execution is performed is the real punishment. I would rather be executed than locked up in jail, beaten and raped by other inmates for decades...
2. It's irreversible. Some people convicted are really innocent.
I agree with both of these statements.
maybe they should recreate the anxiety before execution on a weekly basis, without following through with the execution.
sometimes, just for kicks, they should actually hook up all the electrical devices and have it operated by a car battery or something.
make the death row inmate think, you never know!
LMAO!
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Capital punishment is a pretty bad vengeance. Will a serial killer suffer as much as his victims did? No. If you would like a direct physical punishment to get vengeance, molestation is much better. Thats a real punishment. Cut of the criminal's arms, legs and testicles. Stick out his eyes. That's real vengeance. If you want the criminal taken away for good, so he can never hurt other people again, than you can probably kill him. But then you have to have almost 100% evidence, like a surveillance camera actually catching him in the deed. But capital punishment as vengeance only is childish.
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But then you have to have almost 100% evidence
Yes, that should be the decisive factor when applying the death penalty. But there will not always be a certainty of 100%, which makes it hard to sentence someone for it in order to maintain actual justice.
If it is certain I'm in for all kinds of tough punishments (depending on the deed and circumstances of course). But if that's not the case, I'd rather have them doing hard labour (the 19th century kind of hard labour that is of course). Some convicts may learn to get used to working 18-20 hours per day and may go through their prison time with ease, but they will be of use to society (=shitty jobs the government likes to do as cheap as possible).
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Capital punishment is a pretty bad vengeance. Will a serial killer suffer as much as his victims did? No. If you would like a direct physical punishment to get vengeance, molestation is much better. Thats a real punishment. Cut of the criminal's arms, legs and testicles. Stick out his eyes. That's real vengeance. If you want the criminal taken away for good, so he can never hurt other people again, than you can probably kill him. But then you have to have almost 100% evidence, like a surveillance camera actually catching him in the deed. But capital punishment as vengeance only is childish.
*agrees* Either life in prison or torture, but capital punishment is stupid. :P
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Capital punishment is a pretty bad vengeance. Will a serial killer suffer as much as his victims did? No. If you would like a direct physical punishment to get vengeance, molestation is much better. Thats a real punishment. Cut of the criminal's arms, legs and testicles. Stick out his eyes. That's real vengeance. If you want the criminal taken away for good, so he can never hurt other people again, than you can probably kill him. But then you have to have almost 100% evidence, like a surveillance camera actually catching him in the deed. But capital punishment as vengeance only is childish.
In cases of 100% absolute proof, I would support crucifiction or some other slow, painfull, humiliating death. I liked that idea the one Greek dude came up with. A brass elephant that the convict is placed in. A fire is set below, and the sounds of his screams are tuned into music for the audience to listen to. :evillaugh:
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What's this 100% proof? That is impossible.
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What's this 100% proof? That is impossible.
No, it's rare but not impossible. I'd call a surveillance camera catching someone stabbing or shooting someone to death 100% proof that he did it.
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What's this 100% proof? That is impossible.
No, it's rare but not impossible. I'd call a surveillance camera catching someone stabbing or shooting someone to death 100% proof that he did it.
I guess 100% proof is remotely possible, but a surveillance camera might not provide it. There are identical twins and sometimes even unrelated people can look alike. Once I was stopped walking across a college campus by someone who was convinced that I was her friend "Helen" and she wondered what "Helen" was doing there. Luckily I did not sound like "Helen" so I was able to convince her that I was not her friend, but if "Helen" had commited a crime that was caught on surveillance camera, I could have been convicted of it even though I was completely innocent.
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if the glove does not fit, then you must aquit!
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What's this 100% proof? That is impossible.
No, it's rare but not impossible. I'd call a surveillance camera catching someone stabbing or shooting someone to death 100% proof that he did it.
They could have been framed.