Feeling god

[Tom/Mutate]

A lot of Christians that talk to me base their belief on personal experience "I heard God's voice" "I feel God in my heart" etc. In a world where so many people are in therapy suffering from actual delusions and where there are so many different religions with sincere believers, I don't see why I should take anyone's personal experience/emotional state as serious evidence.

[Pyraxis]

Wanting - that is, considered thought - is the same thing as prayer; as masturbation is to sex, still gets the job done.

That makes the concept of prayer meaningless, as every human wants things, whether they intend to or not.

[Pyraxis]

Do you use your power for good or evil?

Both. 

[vodz]

Wanting - that is, considered thought - is the same thing as prayer; as masturbation is to sex, still gets the job done.

That makes the concept of prayer meaningless, as every human wants things, whether they intend to or not.

It's not a matter of wanting something, like a passing urge.

You said yourself you wanted something as badly as you had previously, so I assume you thought about the desired outcome just as much as when you had invoked God.

Prayer is akin to meditation - taking time to make one's sole action dedicated thoughts.

[Pyraxis]

It's not a matter of wanting something, like a passing urge.

You said yourself you wanted something as badly as you had previously, so I assume you thought about the desired outcome just as much as when you had invoked God.

Prayer is akin to meditation - taking time to make one's sole action dedicated thoughts.

Yeah, but that was kind of my point to begin with - that it's effectively the same process, whether you're invoking Yahweh or Zeus or the essence of balance.

I guess it's just a question of semantics whether you call it prayer or meditation. To me, prayer by definition involves a deity, and meditation may not.

[Taimaat]

As tempting as “godless” spirituality and magic may sound, it still leaves too many holes and questions in it. Such as..
   What is my purpose in life?
   What happens when I have eliminated all my desires?
   What happens if I focus on “wanting” things I would really rather not have?
   Why don't I always get what I think I want?

[Pyraxis]

I've always hated the idea of eliminating one's desires. It seems as if these so-called spiritual paths expect a person to put themselves at odds with their own nature, and fight a doomed battle against their own bodies where nirvana becomes confused with death. Separation from individuality, from the ego border, is revered as this great virtue, and I don't get why, what's so great about it. I've talked to people for whom it was a great spiritual revelation to realize they were "one" with the universe. Can anyone tell me what's the deal? Why do people spend their lives questing after that state?

[Phlexor]

As tempting as “godless” spirituality and magic may sound, it still leaves too many holes and questions in it. Such as..
   What is my purpose in life?
   What happens when I have eliminated all my desires?
   What happens if I focus on “wanting” things I would really rather not have?
   Why don't I always get what I think I want?

Your purpose is whatever you want it to be, isnt that cool?

[odeon]

Of course we are "one" with the universe, considering that we don't have any alternatives, but it's not a spiritual revelation, it's a physical fact.

[Pyraxis]

So what is it that people are discovering, when they have the spiritual revelation?

[choccybiccy]

So what is it that people are discovering, when they have the spiritual revelation?

My whole life is about spiritual revelations, and like any lifestyle choice it comes with its consequences. All mine have been realisations of truths that should have been plain and obvious but were hidden because of my thinking in some way. The phrase 'couldn't see the wood for the trees' is a good way to describe it.

 

Of course we are "one" with the universe, considering that we don't have any alternatives, but it's not a spiritual revelation, it's a physical fact.

Odeons comment is a good example.

[Peter]

So what is it that people are discovering, when they have the spiritual revelation?

My whole life is about spiritual revelations, and like any lifestyle choice it comes with its consequences. All mine have been realisations of truths that should have been plain and obvious but were hidden because of my thinking in some way. The phrase 'couldn't see the wood for the trees' is a good way to describe it.

 

Of course we are "one" with the universe, considering that we don't have any alternatives, but it's not a spiritual revelation, it's a physical fact.

Odeons comment is a good example.

So, taking a science class would be an orgy of spiritual revelations for you?  Where do you draw the line between a spiritual revelation and a mundane realisation?

[choccybiccy]

So what is it that people are discovering, when they have the spiritual revelation?

My whole life is about spiritual revelations, and like any lifestyle choice it comes with its consequences. All mine have been realisations of truths that should have been plain and obvious but were hidden because of my thinking in some way. The phrase 'couldn't see the wood for the trees' is a good way to describe it.

 

Of course we are "one" with the universe, considering that we don't have any alternatives, but it's not a spiritual revelation, it's a physical fact.

Odeons comment is a good example.

So, taking a science class would be an orgy of spiritual revelations for you?  Where do you draw the line between a spiritual revelation and a mundane realisation?

Yep, taking a science class would be. Although I tend to think about things on top of what they are telling me, seeing as I'm naturally more interested in the social, political, semantic and spiritual (or holistic, if you like) mechanics behind what is going on in front of my face (the things taught in science class, while I differentiate between that and actual science, would tend to shed a pretty good light on physical truths). Like everyone I miss things out of my sphere of consciousness because of what interests me (whichever chicken or egg made me who I am, ie whether it's a deterministic existence or not). I don't really draw the line between a mundane realisation and a spiritual one, it's all spiritual.

I've been called Golem before and wasn't happy about it at the time but it made sense to me the more time went on because I have two minds at least.

Here is an equally true to me but seemingly contradictory comment:

No, taking a science class wouldn't be about spiritual revelations because they are only something that is really personal and can't be taught to you by others. They can say things and you can interpret them but that's all it ever is, even though it may seem like more because they talk in your language and make sense to you. It's the sense inside that would be the spiritual revelation. Mundane realisations to me would be things about stuff that were less important to me than the core of my being and of the core of existence. But then maybe not; I've learned that people are not as interested as me and it probably would bore them.

Ah, it's not that contradictory really is it? and has little to do with my golemness i think. That was all shit, but an enjoyable intellectual wank for me so I might as well leave the evidence for posterity.  I know I couldn't do better anyway. Apologies

[Pyraxis]

It wasn't shit; it made some sense to me.

I see no reason people couldn't get spiritual revelations from learning about science, if that was where their passion lay.

However it confirms what I'm already suspecting, which is that people who follow religion and have purely spiritual revelations are simply unaware of their factual basis.

[Parts]

So what is it that people are discovering, when they have the spiritual revelation?

 Their inner insainity