Let's talk about cctv again

[eris]

But you're being recorded, and possibly scrutinized, and there is no privacy at all.

I consder privacy a very important human right.

[Semicolon]

You wouldn't need the cameras at all if everyone in Britain carried a gun. It's much better to shoot a mugger as he tries to steal your valuables than it is to find him and have to go through a trial (which costs taxpayer money). The real problem is the state of gun ownership in Great Britain.

[odeon]

But that's not freedom...


That's Big Brother watching your every move.

How's it not freedom? If you're in public then you have to accept that people can watch you

People *near* you, yes, not Big Brother.

[Adam]

But you're being recorded, and possibly scrutinized, and there is no privacy at all.

I consder privacy a very important human right.

You're in PUBLIC though

This is what I don't understand - everyone seems to go on about privacy when it comes to CCTV. You're in public though. I don't get it. If I'm walking down the street, I'm not gonna do anything I don't want someone seeing, and I'm aware that people could be watching me. If I'm in my room I have privacy

[Adam]

But that's not freedom...


That's Big Brother watching your every move.

How's it not freedom? If you're in public then you have to accept that people can watch you

People *near* you, yes, not Big Brother.

Why does it matter to you if some guy monitoring CCTV sees you walking down the road or sees your car driving down the motorway?

[Parts]

One thing is how it is used here is a fine example

More worrying is the way in which CCTV is being used by the police. Demonstrator Jake Smith was charged with two counts of violent disorder. These charges were later dropped when Smith's solicitor, Matt Foot, viewed the original CCTV footage and discovered that the police video had been edited to show events out of sequence, at one point implying another man was Smith while omitting footage showing Smith being assaulted by a police officer without provocation.

Just a bit from a good article.  http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2010/jul/19/gaza-protests-inquiry-police-cctv

[Queen Victoria]

Let's face it.  With satellites taking pictures, cell phones taking pictures (People of Walmart anyone?), reality shows shooting on the street, there is no more privacy on the streets.  I think it started to vanish with Candid Camera in the 1960's even though you had to sign a release for your part to be seen.

[eris]

It's not the fact that people dont want someone to watch them walk down the street, the point is that we can't walk down the street anymore without being watched

[odeon]

But that's not freedom...


That's Big Brother watching your every move.

How's it not freedom? If you're in public then you have to accept that people can watch you

People *near* you, yes, not Big Brother.

Why does it matter to you if some guy monitoring CCTV sees you walking down the road or sees your car driving down the motorway?

See Parts' reply for a couple of reasons to why.

Do you have your MPs on CCTV? The police? The government? The uni, perhaps? If you want to, can you check up on them, to see what they are doing and how they are spending your tax money? It's only fair. If they can see what you are doing, shouldn't you be allowed to see how they spend your trust?

[Parts]

Here is another

Two council CCTV camera operators have been jailed for spying on a naked woman in her own home.

Mark Summerton and Kevin Judge, from Sefton Council, Merseyside, trained a street camera into the woman's flat.

At Liverpool Crown Court, Summerton, 37, of Kirkdale, Liverpool, admitted voyeurism and attempted voyeurism. He was sentenced to four months in prison.

Judge, 42, from Waterloo, admitted misconduct in public office and was jailed for two months.

He was cleared of voyeurism last month.

Summerton was also ordered to sign the Sex Offenders' Register.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/merseyside/4609746.stm

[Adam]

But you can't walk down the street without being watched anyway - it's in public. you're outside. No privacy. end of.

There are always gonna be examples of misuse. That is obviously a problem and needs to be addressed, but loads of things which are ultimately beneficial can be corrupted. Doesn't mean we should ban them altogether.

As for MPs, police etc - they are on CCTV in the same way that you and I are. In public. They can only check up on what I'm doing when I'm in public too - fair imo

[Adam]

btw you guys are using isolated examples of wrongdoing as evidence that CCTV is wrong in general - yet all the examples of shootings in the US don't seem to show any of you gun-lovers that your gun laws are fucked up

[Semicolon]

btw you guys are using isolated examples of wrongdoing as evidence that CCTV is wrong in general - yet all the examples of shootings in the US don't seem to show any of you gun-lovers that your gun laws are fucked up

Through the use of facial recognition software, the government could potentially build a pattern of an individual's movements and keep continuous surveillance on that person while he/she is in public.

The difference between this and gun laws is that, with guns, the power rests in the hands of the people. With CCTV, the power rests in the hands of the government. Government cannot (easily) abuse a power possessed by the people.

[Parts]

The government should not be doing it just too much potential for abuse. Stores, individuals don't bother me as much as the thought of cops watching my every move.  People will start being careful not to upset them or look to suspicious it will alter the way we act what we do." Look that one is carrying a Koran you know those fucking muslims are trouble"  "look she reads a lot about Nazis we should watch her maybe she is one"  "  Chemistry books they must be bomb makers".

[Adam]

There are always gonna be cases where certain people are under surveillance, whether with CCTV or not  - they do it here with people suspected of cheating benefits.

imo For the risks of abuse associated with CCTV there are more important benefits, for example when they were looking for James Bulger

Also CCTV doesn't really show much of what people read or whether they're interested in explosives - that's other kinds of records being abused there. CCTV mostly just shows you walkig down the street, pretty harmless usually